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  #826  
Old 06-11-2017, 02:12 AM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Oops Half and half - Corsair should fix CLCP fan hotplug

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyV View Post
After hooking up the CLCP, and 2 x HD140 RGB Fans, what I have observed thus far is the following.
  1. Hot plugging fans into the CLCP does not seem to work well, at least in SIV. If I plug a fan into fan port 1 on the CLCP, then unplug it, SIV continues to show it is connected and reports that last known speed. Cycling power to the CLCP seems to clear this. The CLCM does not seem to have this problem.
  2. Most likely this is operator error on my part.
  1. Yes, fan hotplug does not work with the CLCP and I expect this is a CLCP V0.1.131 firmware issue .
    1. There is no clear information on if CLCP fan hotplug should work, but as CLCC fan hotplug does work I expect CLCP fan hotplug to also work . Further CLCP temperature sensor hotplug does work so I feel fan hotplug failing to work must be a firmware bug.
    2. I raised this with Corsair and the response was basically Limitations with hotplugging aren’t a priority.
    3. I suspect the CLCP fan hotplug and detection issues are closely related and feel it would be wise to fix both of them rather than just the detection.
    4. CL 4.7.0.77 does not even report if a fan has been detected as 3-pin voltage or 4-pin PWM and given this CL4 users are unlikey to even notice that CLCP fan hotplug has issues.
    5. This does not mean the CLCP fan hotplug is a SIV issue, but rather that SIV highlights the CLCP fan hotplug intrinsic issue, further I suspect CLCP owners who use SIV are more likely notice this.
    6. AFAIK there are no CLCP related issues in SIV other than ones caused by CLCP firmware issues.
    7. Because of the CLCP fan hotplug and detection issues I enhanced [Link Fans] to dynamically update the fan detection status bolbs.
    8. With your CLCC + H110iGT I expect the blobs will change within about 10 seconds when you hot plug/unplug fans.
    9. With the CLCP I expect not and I expect this is down to a firmware issue.
    10. When I hot plug/unplug fans then power cycle a CLCP while [Link Fans] is active then the blobs do change so I am sure the SIV code is working correctly.
    11. I have been waiting for a SIV user to ask about CLCP fan hotplug since Mon 05-Jun-17 @ 18:55, pondering how long I would have to patiently wait, planning the above reply and thank you for doing this .
    12. Please log a call via https://corsair.secure.force.com/home/home.jsp and ask for the CLCP firmware to be fixed to address fan hotplug.
  2. I feel a certain amount of déjà vu, the CLCP LED setup is identical to the CLNP setup, see the manual for how to do this . To be clear you need to select RGB 12 LED HD Fans .
  3. Obviously I could have posted about the CLCP fan hotplug issue before now, but felt I should wait and see if other CLCP owners also found the issues with CLCP fan hotplug.
Quote:
Originally Posted by red-ray View Post
Quote:

Attached Images
File Type: png Read The Fine Manual.png (161.1 KB, 599 views)
File Type: png [Link Setup] 1 x CLNP + 2 x CLCP.png (65.0 KB, 622 views)

Last edited by red-ray; 06-17-2017 at 03:30 PM. Reason: Add hot plug/unplug fans then power cycle for clarity


  #827  
Old 06-11-2017, 02:28 AM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Confused -NOECR maybe, but what did you change?

Quote:
Originally Posted by cde2006 View Post
Thank Ray, I have the set following qualifier and it is now much better around ~30us:

-TRAY -INDENT -GPUCTL -AIOCTL -SINGLE -NOECR -LOCAL -NOLCD -DRIVER
Jolly good, but what did you change?
  1. I assume you always had -TRAY -INDENT -GPUCTL -AIOCTL -SINGLE
  2. -NOECR maybe, but I doubt this. Maybe if you are also running ASUS AI Suite, though I guess the BIOS may also be accessing the EC in SMM and causing delays.
  3. -LOCAL is unlikely
  4. -NOLCD is unlikely
  5. -DRIVER is the default so is not needed.


  #828  
Old 06-11-2017, 04:58 AM
cde2006 cde2006 is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by red-ray View Post
Jolly good, but what did you change?
  1. I assume you always had -TRAY -INDENT -GPUCTL -AIOCTL -SINGLE
  2. -NOECR maybe, but I doubt this. Maybe if you are also running ASUS AI Suite, though I guess the BIOS may also be accessing the EC in SMM and causing delays.
  3. -LOCAL is unlikely
  4. -NOLCD is unlikely
  5. -DRIVER is the default so is not needed.
I didn't install ASUS AI suite at all.
I did some test and -NOECR is the one. Not sure I understand everything there. What does this option do?


  #829  
Old 06-11-2017, 05:24 AM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Arrow Disable Embedded Controller Reporting (Default is -ECR)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cde2006 View Post
I did some test and -NOECR is the one. Not sure I understand everything there. What does this option do?
Thank you for confirming this and it was the only one I felt it could be.

What it says on the [About] panel which is Disable Embedded Controller Reporting (Default is -ECR).

In general the EC is tricky to report. Maybe I could improve things if I could get the datasheet from ASUS, but ...


  #830  
Old 06-11-2017, 05:33 AM
cde2006 cde2006 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by red-ray View Post
Thank you for confirming this and it was the only one I felt it could be.

What it says on the [About] panel which is Disable Embedded Controller Reporting (Default is -ECR).

In general the EC is tricky to report. Maybe I could improve things if I could get the datasheet from ASUS, but ...
Ok I probably don't need it then...thanks for the info. If it is troublesome maybe having it -NOECR by default is a more sensible option. Let the people who really needs it activate it. Thanks anyway :D


  #831  
Old 06-11-2017, 06:26 AM
pip_jones pip_jones is offline
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Default Out of curiosity ...

Quote:
Originally Posted by cde2006 View Post
Ok I probably don't need it then...thanks for the info. If it is troublesome maybe having it -NOECR by default is a more sensible option. Let the people who really needs it activate it. Thanks anyway :D
I'm curious, do you by any chance have the "ASUS Com Service" running?

On my system, it is installed by default during the windows install process.

If you've got it, could you repeat your tests with this service enabled and disabled? See if it gives you anything?

ASUS_COM_SERVICE.png

In my experiments with the EC i found that this service also caused issues on my system.

Please note that it was NOT and issue with SIV - it was SIV (and Ray!) that spotted the issue.

End result: For me, it wasn't needed, it was just a 3rd party process consuming system resources. So it gets disabled.


  #832  
Old 06-11-2017, 06:58 AM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Idea Maybe I should get SIV to pop up a panel

Quote:
Originally Posted by pip_jones View Post
If you've got it, could you repeat your tests with this service enabled and disabled? See if it gives you anything?
You should be able to start it and stop it at will and when it's active what does Menu->Help->Lock Usage report.

When it's active it should be listed on Menu->Windows->Processes. Please Right/Click on the PID, select Locks and post the resulting panel which will list all the locks it has open.

Maybe I should get SIV to pop up a panel if it's active and -ECR is also in effect . What do you think and would either of you like to test this?

What I have in mind is something similar to http://forum.corsair.com/forums/showthread.php?p=903544

Last edited by red-ray; 06-11-2017 at 07:03 AM.


  #833  
Old 06-11-2017, 07:01 AM
pip_jones pip_jones is offline
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Default Good memory!

Quote:
Originally Posted by red-ray View Post
You should be able to start it and stop it at will and when it's active what does Menu->Help->Lock Usage report.

When it's active it should be listed on Menu->Windows->Processes. Please Right/Click on the PID, select Locks and post the resulting panel which will list all the locks it has open.

Maybe I should get SIV to pop up a panel if it's active and -ECR is also in effect . What do you think and would either of you like to test this?
Great memory Ray, thanks for clarifying what the issue was.

Sure, add the code and I will test it.

KR.


  #834  
Old 06-11-2017, 07:11 AM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Arrow I need to see the two panels so I can figure out how to detect it

Quote:
Originally Posted by pip_jones View Post
Sure, add the code and I will test it.
OK, but I need to see the two panels so I can figure out how to detect it.

Please also post the service information panel that you can get via Menu->Windows->Services->WIN32 Control. This can also be used to start and stop the service.

After pondering this I decided to only do the check if either of -AIOCTL or -GPUCTL is specified.

Please try the attached, I have PMed you the password.

Last edited by red-ray; 06-13-2017 at 05:26 PM. Reason: WIN32 Control + remove test SIV


  #835  
Old 06-11-2017, 11:06 AM
marcelmunarolo marcelmunarolo is offline
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Default

Hello everyone!
Red -> Thank you and gratz for your work on SIV! It's pretty impressive!
I'm switching from CL4 to SIV mainly due the resource (CPU) usage by these programs.
Although both CL4 and SIV shows 1-2% of CPU usage (I7-6700K) I can confirm by running some benchmarks that the PC has more air to breathe with the SIV.

Things are going well so far, the only complain is with SIV my fans (10!) spin at 100% during the boot time. That didn`t happen with CL4. Is there any configuration in order to change this behavior?

Another question is why the values change on the RPM configuration column from time to time, even with these inputs disabled?

Cheers!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg SIV_Fans.JPG (109.0 KB, 586 views)


  #836  
Old 06-11-2017, 11:32 AM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Confused SIV should be using well below 1%

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcelmunarolo View Post

  1. Things are going well so far, the only complain is with SIV my fans (10!) spin at 100% during the boot time. That didn`t happen with CL4. Is there any configuration in order to change this behavior?
  2. Another question is why the values change on the RPM configuration column from time to time, even with these inputs disabled?
Thank you for post and I will answer as best I can, it would be easier for me to do this if you used http://forum.corsair.com/forums/profile.php?do=extra as SIV should use well under 1%
  1. AFAIK when the CLCC firmware is initialising all the fans run at 100% and 2 seconds after SIV starts then the saved values will be loaded into the CLCC and the fan speeds will change. Corsair have declined to make the CLCC datasheet available to me so I do not know if there a way to change this.
  2. When [Link Fans] is opened it's reads the PWM % and RPM values that are displayed from the CLCC firmware and you need to press [Reset] to load the values you saved. It also does this for all the custom points. I implemented this so that when you initially start using SIV it reads the configuration set by CL4 and you don't need to enter it all again.
  3. In addition to posting your PC specs please also post Menu->Edit->View STC Info so I can check why SIV is using so much CPU time, ideally let the plots fill and then take the screen shot.
  4. On this 24 CPU system SIV uses 0.13% CPU time or 3.18% of 1 CPU and much of this is down to me having 4 x GTX 980s.
Quote:
Attached Images
File Type: png [STC Info].png (75.8 KB, 572 views)

Last edited by red-ray; 06-11-2017 at 12:14 PM.


  #837  
Old 06-11-2017, 04:50 PM
SpeedyV SpeedyV is offline
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Default Progress & Observations

Quote:
Originally Posted by red-ray View Post
  1. Yes, fan hotplug does not work with the CLCP and I expect this is a CLCP V0.1.131 firmware issue .
    1. With your CLCC + H110iGT I expect the blobs will change within about 10 seconds when you hot plug/unplug fans.
    2. I have been waiting for a SIV user to ask about CLCP fan hotplug since Mon 05-Jun-17 @ 18:55, pondering how long I would have to patiently wait, planning the above reply and thank you for doing this .
    3. Please log a call via https://corsair.secure.force.com/home/home.jsp and ask for the CLCP firmware to be fixed to address fan hotplug.
  2. I feel a certain amount of déjà vu, the CLCP LED setup is identical to the CLNP setup, see the manual for how to do this . To be clear you need to select RGB 12 LED HD Fans .
  1. Thank you for confirming that the CLCP seems to have a hotplug issue. It seems the only way to get the CLCP to update after hot plugging/unplugging a fan is to cycle power to the device.
    1. Yes fans hot plugged or unplugged into the CLCM do update in SIV after a few seconds.
    2. I am glad that my posting this has pleased you. I suspect that as more people engage the CLCP, more issues will be revealed.
    3. I do plan to log a call to Corsair and ask that the the hotplug issue with the CLCP be addressed. I assume (but have not verified) that the issue must also exist within Link as the issue is with the CLCP, not SIV.

  2. Yes of course you are correct in that I had not set up [AIO link setup] properly. I have since done that and the HD140RGBs are now working properly. So as I suspected - operator error on my part.

Other observations.I don't have any ML fans to directly compare but perhaps these observations will help someone in the decision making process.
  1. The HD140 RGB LED fans are quite nice. They move quite a bit of air with surprisingly low noise. Definitely an improvement over the SP140s and AF140 that I have now. I was going to upgrade to Mag Levs but the release of the CLCP, and your adding RGB support in SIV inspired me to go the HD-RGB route and add more RGB bling instead.
  2. In comparing specs, the HD140-RGB have a higher minimum RPM of 600 verses 400 RPM for the ML140. I have found this 600 RPM minimum figure to be correct - mine will go down to about 580 RPM. 400 RPM would be nice but they are pretty quiet at 600 RPM so I am OK with this.
  3. The max CFM rating for the ML140 is quite a bit higher at 97 CFM verses 74 CFM max for the HD140-RGB, but I assume they have to be spinning at the max 2000 RPM to attain this. Every review I have read said they sound like jet engines at this speed so I doubt many people actually run them that high.
  4. I can't sensibly compare Static Pressure as Corsair lists a range for the ML140 (0.2 - 3.0 mmH2O) but only a single value for the HD140-RGB (1.85 mmH2O). Since they are variable speed, they must have a Static Pressure range but it is not published.
  5. The HD140-RGB has a 2 year warranty verses 5 years for the ML140 but I am not concerned about that. I think either of these fans will run for years beyond that before they start to have problems. Little doubt the hydraulic bearing system in the HD-RGBs will wear out sooner that the MLs.
  6. There is quite a bit of wire management to be done to install the CLCP, CLCM, and the LED Hub and have it not turn into a rat's nest. My stuff is currently spread out all over my desk for testing purposes. I have a Corsair 780T case which has quite a large cavity behind the MOBO mounting plate so I am going to mount everything back there. Then I just have to route the fan and LED cables back into this cavity. It's going to take a while but should look good when it's done. I have attached a "Work in Progress" picture of what it all looks like now.
  7. WHEN oh WHEN is Corsair going to offer the RGB LEDs sold with the Lighting Node Pro as a separate item? I would love to add a few of these but I am not buying a Lighting Node Pro to get them. With the release of the CLCP, they REALLY need to do this. Anyone from Corsair reading this - Is there any plan to do this and if so, when?

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File Type: png WIP 061117.png (1,013.8 KB, 584 views)


  #838  
Old 06-11-2017, 05:18 PM
SpeedyV SpeedyV is offline
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Default Commander Pro Hot Plugging and LED

I have submitted a ticket to Corsair regarding the Commander Pro not detecting a hot plug fan change without a power cycle. Will post if and when I get a response.

Also, a question. I have noticed that there is a single green LED on the Commander Pro. It has never illuminated. Does anyone know what this LED is for? My Commander Mini also has a single green LED which seems to be a power indicator.

Thanks!


  #839  
Old 06-11-2017, 05:58 PM
red-ray red-ray is offline
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Thumbs up I am happy to hear SIV is now controlling all the LEDs

Quote:
Originally Posted by SpeedyV View Post
  1. I do plan to log a call to Corsair and ask that the the hotplug issue with the CLCP be addressed. I assume (but have not verified) that the issue must also exist within Link as the issue is with the CLCP, not SIV.
  1. Firstly I advise against running CL 4.7.0.77 at the same time as SIV as all CPUID SDK 1.1.6.1 locking is broken. I have a half fixed CPUID SDK 1.1.6.6 which I why I feel it's OK for me to do this.
  2. I just tried CL 4.7.0.77 and when I did a hotplug of my 3 x 10K fans and hotunplug of my 3 x HD fans then as I expected CL4 failed to notice this as did SIV.
  3. Being unable to buy just the 5 volt LED strips is just silly and should be trivial to fix. I keep wondering if http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232336005477 will work.
Quote:
Attached Images
File Type: png CL 4.7.0.77 also failed to detect hotplug.png (273.7 KB, 596 views)

Last edited by red-ray; 06-11-2017 at 06:00 PM.


  #840  
Old 06-11-2017, 06:15 PM
SpeedyV SpeedyV is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by red-ray View Post
  1. Firstly I advise against running CL 4.7.0.77 at the same time as SIV as all CPUID SDK 1.1.6.1 locking is broken. I have a half fixed CPUID SDK 1.1.6.6 which I why I feel it's OK for me to do this.
  2. I just tried CL 4.7.0.77 and when I did a hotplug of my 3 x 10K fans and hotunplug of my 3 x HD fans then as I expected CL4 failed to notice this as did SIV.
  3. Being unable to buy just the 5 volt LED strips is just silly and should be trivial to fix. I keep wondering if http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232336005477 will work.
  1. Yes I would not try that myself - at least and not expect weird things to start happening. I only downloaded Link to update the CLCP firmware.Aftger the FW update, I closed Link and stopped the Corsair LINK 4 service before running SIV again. Not sure if that step is necessary.
  2. Hmmm - That is an interesting find on E-Bay. I notice they have several versions - 1M w/ 30 LED, 1M w/ 60 LED etc. Which one would you tend towards?
  3. Also, a Meter is quite a long LED string compared to the others Corsair offers. I wonder if they can be cut and the sections separately connected. This would require adding some connectors to the end of the cut strips but that can be done. They are pretty inexpensive. I will look on the US site and see if they are available. Tempting to give it a try. They must be 5v WS2812B right?
  4. Do you have any idea what the green LED on the CLCP is for? Mine never lights and IIRC, PIP noticed the same thing with his. It looks like the CLNP has one as well, as does my CLCM. On that it seems to just be a power indicator.

Thanks!


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