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  #1  
Old 07-29-2003, 11:43 AM
GungaDin19 GungaDin19 is offline
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Question P4P800 Deluxe and What Memory for....

I have been eyeing up and researching the following components for my new rig:

2.4c P4
ASUS P4P800 Deluxe
2x80 gig WD SE's to put in raid 0 on the VIA/Highpoint controller or 2x36 gig Raptors not in raid 0
ATI 9800 pro

Now here's my dilemma.....I am not sure which DDR to get as some of my choices may be overkill/underkill on this board. I want to go for 1 Gig this time as this is primarily going to be a gaming rig (I want it to be "snappy").

Here are the DDR choices:

2x512 Corsair pc3200 C2
2x512 Corsair pc3200LL
2x512 Corsair pc3500 (would be my last choice because of the price)
2x512 Kingston HyperX pc3500
? <------- whatever else you think!

What I'd like to do with this rig is:

1. Run stock 200 fsb/200 DDR and have PAT enabled. I'd like to be able to do this with MAM on and Turbo on if I want. Are the low timings of the pc3200LL NECESSARY to do this?

2. Have the ability to overclock the FSB up to about 250 max while running the DDR at 200 (5:4 divider). I'd like to be able to hit 3.0 ghz at some point. I never really was an overclocker but I've read alot of success stories with the 2.4c and the P4P800 Deluxe. I am aware that if I do this I will not have PAT enabled.

Most likely I will run the cpu at stock to have PAT (HyperPath) enabled, but then again I would like the ability to overclock.

I know that o/cing is pretty much a crapshoot no matter what you get, but I want to see what you would consider a "safe buy" for what I want to do.

I've read through these forums and still there seems to be no definitive answer on what DDR works the best.

At first people said not to get the pc3200 C2 as the Ram Guy said not to and that he is recommending pc3500 or pc3700. Then I see people getting pc3500 and while that is good and all, it is VERY expensive now and I wonder if it is overkill for my needs.

Finally, now I see Ram Guy recommending pc3200LL for this board. What do I believe?

Also, keep in mind that it is now 7/29/03 and I've heard most of the good chips on modules are gone (BH or something?). If I buy Corsair DDR now am I already going to be handicapped with lesser chips? I would like to buy from Newegg if that matters.

Thanks in advance!
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  #2  
Old 07-29-2003, 02:36 PM
GungaDin19 GungaDin19 is offline
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anyone?
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  #3  
Old 07-29-2003, 08:36 PM
GungaDin19 GungaDin19 is offline
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I was really hoping I'd have gotter a response by now...but no biggie.

PS..........It seems that the only difference between pc3200 c2 (2-3-3-6) and the pc3200LL (2-3-2-6) is the one different number. Is that a big difference?
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  #4  
Old 07-30-2003, 01:45 AM
P4P800Monster P4P800Monster is offline
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If you're going to run at DDR400 then XMS-3200LL. If you want to overclock at all, you pretty much need XMS-3500C2. I have roughly the system you're looking at buying and I'm currently using TwinX1024-3200LLPT, I have them running at 215MHz FSB at 2.5-3-3-6 timings(with PAT and Turbo enabled via P4P8X/P4P800 double BIOS flash mod, highly recommended for any P4P800 owner). I am currently in the process of getting 3500C2 sticks so I can get that Cas Latency down to 2! Oh and my timings at DDR400 were an excellent 2-3-2-6(with PAT and Turbo enabled).
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  #5  
Old 07-30-2003, 07:27 AM
WOLF359 WOLF359 is offline
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PAT and Turbo enabled via P4P8X/P4P800 double BIOS flash mod, highly recommended for any P4P800 owner?

Sounds good.... any suggestions on where I can find this????

I'm currently running P4P800 with 2 3500c2 modules... can't get PAT or Turbo to work. No OC (can't see the point of OC'ing it until I can see the max speed with PAT and Turbo).

Was hoping ASUS would post a bios that would address memory compatibility issues... sigh...

The system is rock solid stable right now, but if I turn on PAT or Turbo - ACK!

Current BIOS is 1007....

Thanks for your input
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  #6  
Old 07-30-2003, 03:02 PM
P4P800Monster P4P800Monster is offline
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Default P4P8X/P4P800 Double BIOS

Doing this mod will void your warranty.(I have however done this to 5 boards successfully, and had 0 problems. The mod is also reversable). If you do this mod you will have to run your memory at 1:1(5:4 and 3:2 will quite literally NOT work), it is also only beneficial to those with 800MHz+ FSB systems.

1 - Create two floppys, you will need one to boot to MS-DOS and another that contains the AFUDOS program and the P4P8X109 BIOS as well as a P4P800 BIOS(rename 1009.007 in step 8 accordingly) of your choice(1009-007 recommended).

2 - Now set your motherboard to defaults and change the fsb to 133 and ram to 266 and reboot...make sure it is running ok UNDERCLOCKED.

3 - Next boot to MS-DOS with your startup disk.

4 - Take your BIOS Disk and type the following after the A prompt: afudos /ip4p8x109.ami /n /pbnc

5 - Let this flash and then reboot(Do NOT enter Windows).

6 - Once again enter your BIOS and set your motherboard to defaults and change the fsb to 133 and ram to 266 and reboot to MS-DOS using your startup disk.

7 - Take your BIOS Disk and type the following after the A prompt: afudos /i1009.007 /n

8 - Let this flash and then reboot.

Congratulations you have just completed the P4P8X/P4P800 double BIOS flash mod. What you have technically done is flashed your system with a P4P8X boot block, and a P4P800 BIOS, this has unoficcially turned your Springdale into a Canterwood. You should now be able to restore the FSB to 200+ and set the ram back to 400. With this mod you should be able to set PAM=Turbo and MAM=Enabled at the same time if you adjust timings accordingly(I was able to achieve 2-3-2-5 at 200MHz). This is assuming your RAM is capable(XMS-3200LL, XMS-3500C2 etc are all capable). Also this mod allows you to run Full PAT over 200FSB, before now even if you set MAM=Enabled it would default to disabled if the FSB was > 200. I would like to give credit for this mod to BigToe of http://www.abxforums.com!

Update: I am now running 2-3-2-7 @ DDR450 with XMS-3500C2 and Full PAT + Turbo
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Last edited by P4P800Monster; 09-17-2003 at 09:31 PM.
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  #7  
Old 07-30-2003, 03:39 PM
Phantron Phantron is offline
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Shouldve gotten the P4C800.....

Oh, and when you Overclock, you don't want turbo. Period. It will not let you Oc with that on. PAT and HT can stay on though. So far so good on my system. I run 3700 TwinX 1 gig of memory. Expensive, but Im at 220fsb with no probs..yummy, 3.080 Gig and climbing

Last edited by Phantron; 07-30-2003 at 03:41 PM.
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  #8  
Old 07-30-2003, 04:21 PM
P4P800Monster P4P800Monster is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by Phantron
Shouldve gotten the P4C800.....

Oh, and when you Overclock, you don't want turbo. Period. It will not let you Oc with that on. PAT and HT can stay on though. So far so good on my system. I run 3700 TwinX 1 gig of memory. Expensive, but Im at 220fsb with no probs..yummy, 3.080 Gig and climbing
You should really educate yourself further before posting, do you use ECC memory? You don't say but the answer is probably not and there's also no reason for it unless you're running a business critical server. The P4P800 is a P4C800 with artificial PAT and no ECC support, it also cost around $70 less. As far as OC'ing with Turbo and PAT it is absolutely possible(maybe not with your more expensive P4C800, but it is with our P4P800's and it shows an increase in performance). Also why don't you check out some of BigToe's results on http://www.abxforums.com and check out his rediculous 3638/3737 unbuffered(6640/6614 buffered) Sandra memory scores with a P4P800 and the aformentioned P4P8X/P4P800 Dual BIOS mod running at 273MHz FSB at 2.5-4-3-7 timings with Turbo and PAT! Now if you have a real reason for getting a P4C800 besides, the general "If it costs more, it must be better theory" please reply. Oh and congratulations on getting that DDR466 memory to run at DDR440 without turbo(my DDR400 can do that with turbo).
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  #9  
Old 07-30-2003, 04:43 PM
Phantron Phantron is offline
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Thats strange, I coulda swore RamGuy or Mike told me Turbo was not a good thing to have on when overclocking..darn wish I could find the post.

Now where those mem benchmarks with Corsair or those Gold OCZ ones that seemingly are breaking OCZ back from exinction? I"ve seen the recent review, its kinda hurtful to see that Corsair can't run those timings even with Samsung chips. Wonder whats up....

Enlightmen me, I forgot what the difference on the unbuffered and buffered memory was, and he didn't elaborate that in the review.

Owell, over $400 for memory is just beyond what i'll spend. This setup is still loads better then my old Athlon rig. Least its stable and OC now then besides that Kingston HyperX 3500 refused to OC period.

Sorry, guess im just fustrated and tired of wasting money and time trying to get my new P4 setup to run correctly..sorry....
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  #10  
Old 07-30-2003, 04:59 PM
P4P800Monster P4P800Monster is offline
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That's alright, I'm just tired of people making unsubstantiated claims that could inform people to make harsh or rash decisions on products. Unbuffered memory benchmarks are considered a more realistic impression of realworld perfomance. The buffered scores show the absolute greatest throughput of the system memory, assuming an application takes advantage of all its features. As for the benches, the originals were with OCZ 3700, but his latest are with some type of PC4000 possibly Corsair(not entirely sure). The purpose of the original post was to show how to unlock Canterwood performance, for Springdale price(It wasn't actually RAM Brand dependant) and I became quite upset that someone would say "Should've gotten the P4C800" without backing it up.
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  #11  
Old 07-30-2003, 05:37 PM
Phantron Phantron is offline
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Do you feel I should be able to run turbo just fine even OC or it just iffy for stability? If so, that be good, I'd let to get max outa this setup as possible. Bummer, im really dissapointed in the Corsair in that test....I'd like see double side though in the comparsion like what im running.

Owell, can't have everything I guess.

As far as the duel Bios flash, I don't the guts to flash my 1007 higher, let alone do that. More power to ya.


Last edited by Phantron; 07-30-2003 at 05:40 PM.
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  #12  
Old 07-30-2003, 05:41 PM
P4P800Monster P4P800Monster is offline
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Default Turbo on P4C800

I'm sorry I can't help you with "Turbo" mode, I don't have a P4C800 and don't even know if it works in the same way as my P4P800. All I know is that Turbo does increase performance when used with the P4P8X/P4P800 Dual BIOS mod. I would post/look around on ABXForums though and you should certainly find an answer to your question.
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  #13  
Old 09-17-2003, 03:46 PM
SFI SFI is offline
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just to let you guys know, i am running the config in my sig, and i have mam and turbo enabled without any problem or having to flash my bios. in fact, without mam and turbo i get errors in memtest. wierd huh :)
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  #14  
Old 09-17-2003, 09:29 PM
P4P800Monster P4P800Monster is offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by SFI
just to let you guys know, i am running the config in my sig, and i have mam and turbo enabled without any problem or having to flash my bios. in fact, without mam and turbo i get errors in memtest. wierd huh :)
You may have MAM enabled, but without the BIOS mod this setting does NOTHING over 200MHz.
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  #15  
Old 09-17-2003, 10:17 PM
SFI SFI is offline
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yes i know, but hey as long as thigns are stable and i am running the ram at its full capacity i am happy. and by the way the ram was faulty and pobviously now i am running smooth as butter :) thanks for your help in the past p4p800monster
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