Help with PSU whine noise even with switch in OFF

[RaaKst]

Hello, some weeks ago I had a problem I with my new PSU (Corsair rm850x shift). It made an intermitent noise, similar to coil whine, which lasted for some seconds and could be heared across the room, and this happened even with the PSU disconnected from PC and the switch in OFF position, only disconnecting it from the plug stopped it. I noticed that I could also hear it constantly but at a much more subtle volume by bringing my ear closer to the area where the cable connects to the PSU (again with the switch OFF). If I connected the cable (already plugged) to the PSU, it also made a short spark noise.

I RMA it and got a new one, but trying it today (before installing it to the PC) it has the same problem, no matter which plug I use in my house... I have an old rm750x that has been working well for years, and doesnt have this kind of problem so I don´t think my house is the cause. Could it be the model's fault? Is the first shift PSU I build in a PC, or maybe I have terrible luck and this PSU is defective too, or the components are more sensitive to the electrical current generating coil whine and my hearing can hear thar frequency, but it doesn't make sense to me that this happens when the switch of the PSU is OFF, not letting the current pass. Should I RMA it, try to get a different model if they allow or get used to the noise? Thanks.

I tried to record the noise, my phone is not that good at recording high pitch sounds, but I think you can hear with max volume, especially at the end (the noise gets higher and then stops): https://www.veed.io/view/d4e9a91a-22ac-4cbb-a50f-16900b4524fc?panel=share

[TGAlex]

Hi, with the PC on, does it sound as loud? And what if you increase the load either via the GPU, CPU or even a USB port? Does it make any difference?

[RaaKst]

8 hours ago, TGAlex said:

Hi, with the PC on, does it sound as loud? And what if you increase the load either via the GPU, CPU or even a USB port? Does it make any difference?

Hi, the PSU makes this noise regardless of the load. It doesn't matter if it is connected to the PC, at idle, stress testing... I can't detect any change in the intensity of the sound, the lenght or the frequency.

It makes the sound with the PSU out of the PC and the switch in O position (which supposedly blocks the current). I tried different plugs in my home while disconnecting as many other devices as posible to see if it is because interference, but it still happens.

[TGAlex]

The PSU isn't 100% off when you switch it off, there will be current coming in so long as it's plugged into the wall socket.

And guessing by the fact that you had to send the defective over to Corsair, you tried the new one using its own power cable, so it's not the cable either. I would say you tried it at a friend's house but it probably wouldn't make any difference. Still, just so you've tried everything, you could do that too. The way I see it, it's either another defect, which is mindbogglingly unfortunate, or it's something that the PSU doesn't like, some frequency that's still interfering in spite of having disconnected most of the devices. And I'm talking about the PSU model, not the unit in specific. Although annoying, it shouldn't be raising any concern, if that's what's happening. Is there a way you can request a different model, preferably a higher tier and you could cover the price difference if it's only slightly more expensive?

[RaaKst]

15 minutes ago, TGAlex said:

The PSU isn't 100% off when you switch it off, there will be current coming in so long as it's plugged into the wall socket.

And guessing by the fact that you had to send the defective over to Corsair, you tried the new one using its own power cable, so it's not the cable either. I would say you tried it at a friend's house but it probably wouldn't make any difference. Still, just so you've tried everything, you could do that too. The way I see it, it's either another defect, which is mindbogglingly unfortunate, or it's something that the PSU doesn't like, some frequency that's still interfering in spite of having disconnected most of the devices. And I'm talking about the PSU model, not the unit in specific. Although annoying, it shouldn't be raising any concern, if that's what's happening. Is there a way you can request a different model, preferably a higher tier and you could cover the price difference if it's only slightly more expensive?

I can try it in another house next weekend to see if it is something in mine causing the noise. I too think it would be too strange to get 2 defective units with the same problem, so this model maybe has components sensitive to something in my house.

I've also sent a ticket to the store, maybe I can change it for another model as you say. I chose this one because I had 0 problems with my old rm750x, and the shift version seemed like an upgrade (easier cable management and ATX 3.0). Would you try with a normal rm850x? I don't know much about other brands.

My main concern is if this could be dangerous (like fraying my PC in the future or something). If I can't change it for another model, I guess I will have to ignore the noise, but it is difficult because it's intermittent and in different volumes, making it unexpected and annoying...

[TGAlex]

Unfortunately I can't suggest a modern PSU other than the AX1600i. I have two of them in two different systems and have run both at two different houses, never had coil whine or any other noise, only problem is it's expensive. Every PSU before these was older, so different EMI standards. So I guess I would search for feedback on coil whine if I were to buy another model, unless somebody else can chime in.

Unfortunately if it's an EMI thing, it is considered "normal" even though technically it's not as it shouldn't have passed EMC testing. But other than that, as far as I know it's safe, you can ask an electrician whether EMI is capable of affecting a product's performance. It shouldn't. But you have to be sure it's EMI. I think if it doesn't make the noise at your friend's, we can safely assume that this is it, but problem is, it can still be that if it makes the noise! The other thing you can do, but you'll probably have to buy your friend a beer, is have them bring their perfectly quiet, modern PSU over and try it at your place. But first see what yours does at theirs.

Either way, you certainly need to request another model if it's driving you crazy and state that both units of the same model make an unbearable noise that shouldn't be there. Send them a video of it. I don't see how they can refuse. Honestly, because I'm paranoid about noises, I wouldn't accept it. Go higher tier and cover the price difference or your money back.

[RaaKst]

Yes, the store is asking me for some videos, lets hope they allow me to change it for another model. I was looking for other atx3.0 units in my price range in that store, and there arent other corsair models... They have a seasonic and a msi one but I've never had a PSU from that brands. I could get a rmx850 but its not atx3.0 and I would have to buy the 16 cable too, so i dont have to use the adapter from the GPU.

[TGAlex]

Wow, here's what a quick search on MSI coil whine turned up:

https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/691876/power-supply-makes-a-static-coil-whine-noise-when-the-power-supply-is-off-and-th

That individual is actually experiencing an identical issue on an MSI MAG A750GL, slightly less powerful than yours but I guess I'd stay away from that product line altogether.

The second reply if you scroll down a bit also mentions that the EMI could be coming from the GPU, though you said you tried it outside and away from the case so it has to be something else.

I was wondering, can you visit the store, like physically? What if you brought the video along but also ask that they give it a try too? If it makes the noise then you can pick another model and request a tryout before you purchase. If the store has a workshop dept there should be several EMI sources. Just do that man, skip your friend's house, the noise is annoying anyway and you shouldn't have to "get used to it".

Edited September 9 by TGAlex

[RaaKst]

Unfortunately, it's a digital store so thats not possible, but I'm waiting right now for their response to the videos I sent them. About the MSI PSU, I was considering one from their MPG line, which is better than the MAG one, but I guess Seasonics would be a better choice if they allow me to change it according to what is searched.  

Lets see what they tell me today... but you are right, I doesn't matter if it doesn't make the noise in other house, that doesn't solve it in mine...

[RaaKst]

11 hours ago, TGAlex said:

Wow, here's what a quick search on MSI coil whine turned up:

https://electronics.stackexchange.com/questions/691876/power-supply-makes-a-static-coil-whine-noise-when-the-power-supply-is-off-and-th

That individual is actually experiencing an identical issue on an MSI MAG A750GL, slightly less powerful than yours but I guess I'd stay away from that product line altogether.

The second reply if you scroll down a bit also mentions that the EMI could be coming from the GPU, though you said you tried it outside and away from the case so it has to be something else.

I was wondering, can you visit the store, like physically? What if you brought the video along but also ask that they give it a try too? If it makes the noise then you can pick another model and request a tryout before you purchase. If the store has a workshop dept there should be several EMI sources. Just do that man, skip your friend's house, the noise is annoying anyway and you shouldn't have to "get used to it".

So, I sent 4 different videos both inside and outside the PC, apparently they cant hear any noise, and they ask me to RMA it again if I want. I've asked them to hear with max volume, and if it is possible to exchange for another model. Can you hear the noise? I dont know if my phone is **** at recording high pitch sounds, uploading to internet takes some quality  or I'm getting crazy...  mhttps://www.dropbox.com/scl/fo/adt9qj7sc8kpgeu32kkzi/ALEbuyz_0TEZjKAiDCRx-cg?rlkey=larrk74tc7f8wsn65vvpukpw6&st=zd17m28d&dl=0

[LeDoyen]

tell them to go clean their ears or to ask someone under 80 to listen to the videos 😛

With the PSU off, i can only assume you have a damn noisy power in your house, maybe a bad earth?

That kind of whistling can be caused by a shoddy power supply somewhere in the circuit, like phone chargers, or even neon ballasts that reinject EMI in the circuit.

With the switch off, i assume the only way the input protection in the PSU whistle like that is by having crap flowing between neutral and earth, and that's not coming from the power supply.

[RaaKst]

1 hour ago, LeDoyen said:

tell them to go clean their ears or to ask someone under 80 to listen to the videos 😛

With the PSU off, i can only assume you have a damn noisy power in your house, maybe a bad earth?

That kind of whistling can be caused by a shoddy power supply somewhere in the circuit, like phone chargers, or even neon ballasts that reinject EMI in the circuit.

With the switch off, i assume the only way the input protection in the PSU whistle like that is by having crap flowing between neutral and earth, and that's not coming from the power supply.

Thanks for the answer, as I said previously, I can try it in another house to test it, but none of my past PSU had this problem, including some not certified, and corsair ones, and I live in a modern building with less than 10 years with no "electrical" problems.

Do you think getting another brand could solve it if the cause is bad flowing between neutral and earth? Is there something I can do to improve it? I dont think I can get used to this noise if every PSU is going to do it...

[TGAlex]

I can hear the noise at 50% volume, nice and clear, bro at the store needs to turn on their speakers, usually they're very quiet when off.

Many times a different model will fix that, so you can go ahead and request another model, like I said something of a high tier if it's not a lot more expensive and if there's no change then you should be dealing with something in the building. In that case, just to confirm, try that new PSU at a friend's and have them bring their modern PSU over. If they both only make the noise at your place, then you know it's the building and the reason your older PSU's were noise-free is the different EMI standards, they just weren't picking up certain frequencies. So when you've established that, your next step would be to consult an electrician.

These problems are very annoying and I can totally relate, I had terrible experience with powerlines a few years back, even though the house and electrics aren't old either. I dunno who f** up but I spent weeks dealing with crappy internet. Wasn't even worth fixing it considering the alternative, I just moved to WiFi extenders (wireless from router to extenders, then ethernet) and the internet instantly went to 100% of the nominal speed (up from 75% and unstable on powerlines).

[RaaKst]

12 minutes ago, TGAlex said:

I can hear the noise at 50% volume, nice and clear, bro at the store needs to turn on their speakers, usually they're very quiet when off.

Many times a different model will fix that, so you can go ahead and request another model, like I said something of a high tier if it's not a lot more expensive and if there's no change then you should be dealing with something in the building. In that case, just to confirm, try that new PSU at a friend's and have them bring their modern PSU over. If they both only make the noise at your place, then you know it's the building and the reason your older PSU's were noise-free is the different EMI standards, they just weren't picking up certain frequencies. So when you've established that, your next step would be to consult an electrician.

These problems are very annoying and I can totally relate, I had terrible experience with powerlines a few years back, even though the house and electrics aren't old either. I dunno who f** up but I spent weeks dealing with crappy internet. Wasn't even worth fixing it considering the alternative, I just moved to WiFi extenders (wireless from router to extenders, then ethernet) and the internet instantly went to 100% of the nominal speed (up from 75% and unstable on powerlines).

The store doesn't allow me to change it for another model, but they told me to RMA it and ask for a refund, strange because their policy only gives 1 month to ask for a refund after buying the product, so I asked them to confirm this to me. This way I can try to buy another model to test it and from other stores too, till I get a good one. 

I tried it in another part of the building, kind of a basement, with no devices connected near. I could only try it for 10 min but I heard the sound twice, It hasn't been the loudest of all times, but I have been there for a short time, sometimes it takes 30 or more minutes until I get one of the loud ones in my room.

Unfortunately my friends are more into consoles and laptops/tablets so I won't be able to test any PSU from them, and I'm sharing the house so any kind of work done of this kind takes a lot of discussing, convincing and time, so I hope it doesn't get to that point, because it will probably end with me dealing with the noise till I move (which is not easy right now in my country).

Lets hope I get good news tomorrow from the store, and I can start trying other models soon. I heard seasonics were a good brand for PSU too and there is a model with atx3 for just 20€ more than the shift. 

[RaaKst]

So, bad news... They only offer me to change it for the same model, and no option of getting a refund. I will try again, maybe I'm lucky... but it seems I will just have to deal with the noise. Can this kind of noises get better with time? Is not the same but I've had coil whine in GPU in the past improving after months...

[TGAlex]

It will if what's causing it subsides, so to speak.

EMI intensity and PSU build quality is what determines the kind of noise that you can hear. Sometimes EMI isn't strong enough or the PSU is able to block most of that noise so that you can't hear anything. A higher tier PSU for instance, would've probably been able to filter out more frequencies. So if that's out of the question (strange that they didn't accept to replace it for a more expensive unit, when you'd cover the price difference, but that's another story), what you need to do is mitigate, or even negate the effects of whatever is causing it. That's where a good electrician comes in, whose job would be to identify the cause and make suggestions, for example, noise filters, from which everyone would benefit, including your roommate.

Let's see if that third PSU is any different, but don't get your hopes up. And let us know if it whines somewhere else.

Plot twist: it's perfectly fine at your place and whines at your friend's. 😵 Not that that would ruin your day!

[RaaKst]

13 hours ago, TGAlex said:

It will if what's causing it subsides, so to speak.

EMI intensity and PSU build quality is what determines the kind of noise that you can hear. Sometimes EMI isn't strong enough or the PSU is able to block most of that noise so that you can't hear anything. A higher tier PSU for instance, would've probably been able to filter out more frequencies. So if that's out of the question (strange that they didn't accept to replace it for a more expensive unit, when you'd cover the price difference, but that's another story), what you need to do is mitigate, or even negate the effects of whatever is causing it. That's where a good electrician comes in, whose job would be to identify the cause and make suggestions, for example, noise filters, from which everyone would benefit, including your roommate.

Let's see if that third PSU is any different, but don't get your hopes up. And let us know if it whines somewhere else.

Plot twist: it's perfectly fine at your place and whines at your friend's. 😵 Not that that would ruin your day!

I live in a second floor, and tested it at the basement of the building and still got the noise so it must be something in the building, and thats gone be difficult to solve. I read aboout using ferrite cores in the cable, bit I dont know if they would help here. 

I was surprised with the store too, but they told me they only offer refunds the first 30 days... I suggested changing it for the new rm850x atx3 which is more expensive but no luck... 

Would contacting directly with corsair help more? Thanks