(Another I guess) 7000D and radiator layout question.

[Steiner-KD]

Hello Corsair experts!
I'm just starting a new build which will be my biggest ever so far based around the new AMD 7000 CPU and GPUs. It will have full custom loop water cooling and my main aim is for silent running rather than max overclock. I just got my new 7000D Airflow (Only ever use Corsair cases) and now trying to figure out what radiators to get.
I will go a bit overkill (before anyone mentions it 😉 ) And thinking 3 rads, front, top and side where the side mounted one will be slim and passive (no fans). For front and top I'm planning on 45mm thick ones and all will be push oriented (in front out top).
Now I wonder what sizes I can get away with for this setup and still be able to run tubing. It looks like I can get away with a slim passive 360/480 mounted to the side without interfering with windows offset top and side rads regardless of thickness (only the tubing might be an issue?). What about mixing front and top with 45mm RADs? Will 360 top and 480 front work, or will I be limite to 2 360's (planning to keep all ports on top).
For the side mounted rad I'm guessing the ports will be the main issue and maybe a centered slim 360 might sort that?
Please share your experiences and thoughts. (pictures if you have them).

TIA and best Wishes
Thomas

[LeDoyen]

Can't say about the fitment as i don't own the case, but here are a few general custom loop ideas 🙂

If  you have the possibility to install 3 active slim rads instead of 2 fatter active and one slim passive, maybe consider it.

without fans, you really have to have very negative, or very positive pressure in the case to push some air through that passive rad.

you'll have to make the other fans work harder which seems to defeat the goal of a silent build. Lots of slow fans are usually quieter 🙂

 If you use front intake, making the front rad dump its heat on the two others, it could be a good idea to make it last in the loop, to minimize that slight inefficiency as much as possible. Usually i prefer top exhaust first in loop anyway. that will be the hottest rad.. then you can go to side then front for example, and back to the reservoir. (try to put the reservoir after the rads too. it's good form 😛 no point in having a warm water buffer)

and btw since AMD 6000 and Nvidia 3000 series, 3 rads isn't overkill anymore !

[Steiner-KD]

2 hours ago, LeDoyen said:

Usually i prefer top exhaust first in loop anyway. that will be the hottest rad.. then you can go to side then front for example, and back to the reservoir. (try to put the reservoir after the rads too.

That's the order I'm planning. Through GPU and CPU loop will go through the top (so likely the one I should make the thick one) then through side (if I go that route), then Front and then back to reservoir. Side will be thin regardless and I'm not sure I can do fans on it if I do front rad. I might do 3x360, that way I can offset them slightly vertically to make ports clear. The top one I'll likely make x-flow to lessen then tube clutter across the motherboard. Either front or top will be thicker I think, but might just do 3 thin too. The AMD parts are still at least a month a way so have time to fiddle before I order rads.
Thank you for your input.

[Kontio]

Moin ....

 

ich habe das 7000 RGB und habe zwei 420 Radiatoren (30mm) verbaut (incl. Lüfter) ..... Ein weiterer Radiator , hätte da keinen Platz.....

[Steiner-KD]

1 hour ago, Kontio said:

Moin ....

ich habe das 7000 RGB und habe zwei 420 Radiatoren (30mm) verbaut (incl. Lüfter) ..... Ein weiterer Radiator , hätte da keinen Platz.....

Yes, with 140mm based rads the width become an issue, but with 120mm based rads and offset to the windows a side mounted passive should fit fine, only issue being clearance for the in/out ports. But that's why I'm discussing hare, looking for more input from users like you with actual experience.

[LeDoyen]

have you checked the builders guide in the product page on the corsair site?

https://www.corsair.com/corsairmedia/sys_master/productcontent/CORSAIR_7000_Series_XD3_XD5_XD7.pdf

It has example builds with 3 radiator setups using a mix of 140 and 120mm wide rads

[Steiner-KD]

2 hours ago, LeDoyen said:

have you checked the builders guide in the product page on the corsair site?

https://www.corsair.com/corsairmedia/sys_master/productcontent/CORSAIR_7000_Series_XD3_XD5_XD7.pdf

It has example builds with 3 radiator setups using a mix of 140 and 120mm wide rads

I had actually, but not thorough enough it seems as it basically shows one solution I came up with myself during the evening while measuring.
Can have a 30/45mm 360 in the roof, then a 30/45 in the front who will sit as far down as possible. Those two can have fans. Then you can have one more 30mm without fans against the backwall  that you offset from the floor a bit so the ports are above the top of the front rad. This interleaving allow you to have all three rads, two cooled and one passive. The tubing sure won't be pretty though 🙂
thank you for reminding me. Now I might also consider a 420 fort he top, but might stay with a 360 as I will use a crossflow one with tanks on both ends making it slightly bigger.

[LeDoyen]

damn, who are those people who read manuals and do researches on their own... i'm out! lol

on the 3 rads setup, none is passive. they all have fans fitted. even if the front one is 15mm thicker, i don't see where it will collide with the side fans. Of course it would cover the two lower fans a little bit more though. You can see on the first page how much is covered with a XR5 (30mm).

At least that's how it looks like to me

[Steiner-KD]

2 hours ago, LeDoyen said:

damn, who are those people who read manuals and do researches on their own... i'm out! lol

on the 3 rads setup, none is passive. they all have fans fitted. even if the front one is 15mm thicker, i don't see where it will collide with the side fans. Of course it would cover the two lower fans a little bit more though. You can see on the first page how much is covered with a XR5 (30mm).

At least that's how it looks like to me

The clearing from the radiator mount in the side wall to the edge of the front radiator bracket is 40mm, even with windows offset of the front rad I think getting fans in on the side rad might be tough, but you are quite correct, it does show a slim side mounted rad with fans. Hmm, still think I might go passive for the side one for now, can always add the fans later.
I do read manuals religiously even before buying a  product, but for some reason the fact that my answer was in there passed me by. :X

[LeDoyen]

regarding adding fans later on, another caviat ^^ If you want to screw fans to the side rad after the fact, you'll have to take out the front radiator, given the supertight clearance 😛

After all, passive with no fans, and passive with fans off is identical. You could install them (if it fits, should if we go by the guide), and leave them off.

If you prefer the bare radiator look, you can still mount them on the other side, in pull for example.

Or leave them out as planned 😛

[Steiner-KD]

6 hours ago, LeDoyen said:

regarding adding fans later on, another caviat ^^ If you want to screw fans to the side rad after the fact, you'll have to take out the front radiator, given the supertight clearance 😛

After all, passive with no fans, and passive with fans off is identical. You could install them (if it fits, should if we go by the guide), and leave them off.

If you prefer the bare radiator look, you can still mount them on the other side, in pull for example.

Or leave them out as planned 😛

Well, it's not just a matter of looks and fit, it's also an issue of managing additional fans as well as the economy of it (maybe a bit ridiculous worrying over 3 extra fans for a build around 8k us). I think I'm going to order the rads and play around with positioning, then I will know if I will order fans for all 3 rads. Likely make both front and side intakes and up out through the roof.
The radiator bracket removes out through the back so I can just pop it out and add the fans, or pop out the front bracket. Since rad/bracket/fans are separate self contained units working with rad groups is no issue.

[Kontio]

Bei mir sieht es momentan so aus .....

 

Zwei 420er Radiatoren mit sechs 140mm QL Lüfter. Einen 140er QL Lüfter hinten, und vier 120er QL Lüfter an der Seite 

 

Gruß Kontio

[Steiner-KD]

It definitely gets a bit tight in the back with a 140mm rad, I'm pretty sure I can get away with a passive using 120mm rads all around though, quite possible even with fans although they would be a bit covered and starved.

[LeDoyen]

In one of my builds i had a 360mm flat reservoir sitting on its side over the bottom radiator of my case, blocking about a good 1/4 of the surface of the 3 fans. Didn't notice a difference compared to when the reservoir was upright in another spot, if that may help.

if you have the equivalent of 2 - 2.5 fans exposed to air, it's still better than 0.

Also, if you use a normal split flow radiator and not a cross flow in that position, you won't have warm water carry over from the blocked off spots.

 

Another idea if i may throw my grain of sand in your cog :  2x 420mm rads is 117600mm². 3x360mm rads is 129600 mm².  it has the equivalent of like a 110mm radiator more which isn't much.

Two 420mm radiators, all populated with larger (quieter) slow spinning 140mm fans... less fittings and tube runs allowing for less flow restriction (slower running pump for the same flow).. That also sounds like something to consider?

[Steiner-KD]

You have some very valid points. I'm a fan of 140mm fans/rads and that's what I currently use in my system. I think Is aw a product support reply from Corsair stating that yes indeed you can do 2x420 rads (front and top) but are then limited to slim rads (30mm). I plan for two of my rads to be medium (45mm) thickness, If you compare what I plan vs 2x420 slim you get a "cooling volume" of 3528 cm³ (140mm) vs 5184 cm³ (120mm). those numbers might not be very relevant though as the surface area you mentioned is more important.
My rationale for the crossflow rad at the top is to avoid coolant hoses going across the motherboard as much as possible. The CPU out will go up top left and the top rad out will go from top right to the side mounted rad.
After talking to you I think I will do fans on the side mounted rad too instead of having it passive, if I can get away with it fit wise. Those will be more stealth and not RGB though. (To be honest I'm not sure I want RGB fans at all, there will be enough light from mobo and EK parts).
Thank you for sharing your thoughts and bouncing ideas, it helps the process. and as any of the actual parts are still far from release there's plenty time.

Edited September 4, 2022 by Steiner-KD
Typos

[stone91]

I think u can put rad in all possible locations. I got 140 rad rear, 360 rad top side front respectively. Just need to make sure the thickness of the rad.

[LeDoyen]

4 hours ago, Steiner-KD said:

 If you compare what I plan vs 2x420 slim you get a "cooling volume" of 3528 cm³ (140mm) vs 5184 cm³ (120mm). those numbers might not be very relevant though as the surface area you mentioned is more important.

What you gain in thickness isn't as straightforward, as thicker rads have lower FPI.

XR5 are 16 FPI while XR7 are 13 fpi. That's less fins, but they are longer. not an easy comparison but we're probably talking half a bee's d*** in terms of cooling. The lower FPI probably facilitates airflow and gives em an edge.

But, they are still higher water flow. 45mm is still a sweet spot as you get good water flow, and it still doesn't impede fans too much compared to say 60mm rads.

I believe @c-attack did some tests on several rad thicknesses if i remember a previous post some time ago 😛 Maybe he'll comment on the pros and cons of a mix of slim and 45mm 360 vs two slim 420, but my guess is they should be fairly close.

In terms of silence, since it's your main focus, again it should be fairly similar if you have tons of rad space. You should be able to trade a few °C of water temperature for lower RPM.

Under heavy load, my PC is noisy AF if i go for a max temperature of 36°C, but very quiet if i let the water reach 40°C max.

Whatever setup you go for, given the TDP rumors, you should have plenty of headroom to trade temp and silence back and forth to your heart's content

[Steiner-KD]

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'll be good regardless and be a bit overkill/room to maneuver, still interesting to discuss options and variations thought since it's still a month out the first items will even be on the market  (Ryzen 9 7950x and Asus ROG Crosshair x670e Extreme).
And yes, the reason you said is why I'm going for the 45mm rads for the main job, it's supposed to be the cooling sweetspot.

[c-attack]

It's hard to find any meaningful data for 420mm or 560mm radiators these days.  The difference between a 45mm 360 and 30mm 420mm is going to be near zero, with fan speed being the determining factor.  That is another thing that makes comparisons difficult since noise from 3x140 will not be same as 3x120 at XXXX rpm.  It does seem clear you are limited to 420x30 up top.  Given your preference for 140mm fans and the case was actually designed for it, you might as well make use them.  In order to take advantage of the 45-60mm radiator extra thickness, you typically need to bump the speed up.  At least 1500 rpm on 120mm model and typically 1300 for 140s.  All in all we still are talking about single degree differences, so radiator restriction and fit should probably be a higher priority.  

 

That is about where my concern comes in.  3 XR5 radiators is a lot of resistance.  You would be likely to loose any temperature gain from the passive radiator in slow down time of the fluid in the blocks.  I have run 3 XR5 360s before and it was a very short experiment with clear negative results.  You would need the pump at maximum speed when under load to keep the liquid from lingering in the block.  You might give some consideration to just 2 radiators (perhaps top and side exhaust) to keep flow restriction down and intake air temperature lower.  While the layout is slightly different, in lengthy experiments with multiple O11 cases, the three radiator system only worked when you start opening panels to resolve the airflow temperature problem.  Otherwise you must exhaust one radiator into the other(s) or try and get all your intake from the rear.  In my experience forcing the third radiator is counterproductive.  

[Steiner-KD]

@c-attack Thank you for your informed and valuable input. Unfortunately I already ordered my rads (Enthusiastic and impatient to get started), but I have a 30 day open buy with free returns so might still make adjustments. The ordered rads are; 1 crossflow 360 120x45 for the top, 1 360 120x45 for the front and 1 360 120x30 for the rear wall. I guess I could just skip the rear wall one altogether and just put 4 fans there instead. I really haven't thought much about the flow resistance and I will be using a D5 to push the coolant.
The radiators will not be Corsair (sorry) and I think my 7000D Airflow have decent airflow.
In my current machine I only have 1 slim 420 rad cooling the CPU alone and with low fan speeds keep CPU at about 36-40 degrees (fairly warm room)

[LeDoyen]

regarding flow restriction and temps, i guess it depends a lot on your waterblocks too.

I use 3x slim 360 rads and before i re-tubed it to get rid of 90° fittings, i had more than enough flow with the D5 at 50 - 60% PWM.

Some blocks works very well with smaller flows, some are less efficient and require a ton of flow.. and you may see temperatures increase if the loop is too restricitive.

At its worst, my loop topped at 200L/h, with 2 slim 360 and a slim 240, 90° fittings everywhere.. and the temps were just fine with half of that flow. below 70L/h the GPU started to heat up quickly, which was around 40% PWM.

With another waterblock, that threshold will be different so it's hard to compare. Just saying it can work, with headroom.

 

[Steiner-KD]

As the rads arrived I had to test fit my interleaving and drain valves idea. With the front rad in the outermost position I can just squeeze in fans on top of the side mounted rad. For front and top there's no clearance issues whatsoever as can be seen. The swivel able EK drain valves at the bottom looks nice and functional too.
 

[c-attack]

Flow restriction should not be an issue with those radiators. The XR5 series is higher restriction, but that’s also part of the design. Only an issue when stringing together several plus blocks and a decent amount of vertical travel. X-flow is not very restrictive and the other two are medium. All combined about the same as a cpu block. Airflow management will be more important here. 

[Steiner-KD]

Hmm yeah, atm I'm thinking pushing air in from the front and pulling in air through the side, then out through top and back. Not sure.  In all there will be 10 fans to play with, one 140mm in the back (no filter so preferably out) and 3*3 on the radiators, all filtered so can all be used for input.

[LeDoyen]

you have some of those on sale everywhere :

https://www.amazon.fr/SIENOC-Magnétique-Refroidisseur-Ventilateur-Ordinateur/dp/B07YYWV96W/

i use a 120mm for back intake, works as intended 🙂