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  #1  
Old 11-14-2019, 01:42 AM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Default H100i Installation questions

Corsair team,

I have a problem:

I am building a new system. I have bought the H100i PRO RGB.

The motherboard is Asus ROG Strix Z390-F. It has a total of 7 fan headers, CPU_FAN, CPU_CPU_OPT, AIO_PUMP, CHA_FAN1, CHA_FAN2, W_PUMP+ and M.2_FAN.

I have no problems getting the fans and radiator hooked up and fitted to the roof of the case. That's part is done.

Now I am in the middle of installing the pump to the CPU and before I fit it into the socket, I notice there are 3 cables:
1) SATA ---- This one I know it is required to connect to the PSU SATA cable, I have no problem with it.
2) The 3-pin female connector
3) A Y-split cable with two male 4 pin connectors.

I have connected the two fan's cables to the CPU_FAN and OPT_FAN on my motherboard. Can I leave the Y-split cable and connect the 3-pin female connector to one of the fan headers like AIO_PUMP on my motherboard?
I understand this is not as instructed in the manual. Because I want to monitor the 2 fan's speed and the pump speeds in BIOS, so I connect them this way.

Will this arrangement damage the pump?
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  #2  
Old 11-14-2019, 03:36 AM
Bristlebeard Bristlebeard is offline
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Just out of curiosity, is there a reason you don't want to monitor the fan speeds, and see pump information in Corsair Link?
It makes it super easy to see what's happening and make custom fan curves without having to go into the bios.

This is from C-Attack commenting on a H100i V2 install

"There is nothing special about the AIO_Pump header, other than it is usually set to 100%/12v by default. It is really just a marketing gimmick on the last two motherboard series. It used to be a CHA_FAN #4, but was renamed. Thankfully, you can reset the header to behave like any other chassis header if you need the connection for a normal case fan -- at least on Asus boards."
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  #3  
Old 11-14-2019, 07:16 AM
c-attack c-attack is online now
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The SATA is the only essential piece. That is your power.

The “3 pin” is just a tachometer wire. It will report a pump speed to BIOS and for your intended set up that is useful so you know the pump is running. The QFan settings will be irrelevant, but it’s still better to choose disabled or Full Speed so the BIOS doesn’t get stuck trying to tune a device it can’t control.

The splitter is only needed if you intend to run the fans from the pump’s controller.

You will not damage the hardware in this configuration.



Now whether this best suits your needs is another question. Even if you do not want to run the iCUE software, you may be better off installing, saving your color, pump, and fan speeds to the device, then set iCUE not to run on start up. It will follow instructions and you can launch to troubleshoot or change the pump from color cycle to white or whatever. Without this step, the pump and fans will go rainbow madness until the end of time.

A second issue may be cpu/opt fan control. Those two headers were meant for air tower fans and they have very quick response times — something completely needless on a water system. I have not tested on Z390, but historically those two headers ignore the specified fan delays under a number of conditions, one of which is rapid cpu temp change. Really annoying to have the fans ramp up to max when you hit a game loading screen or your anti-virus kicks in. If you decide you need bios/MB control, you might look at using a CHA fan header on a splitter. Better still would be a 10K thermistor to the back of the radiator, but I am not sure the F has that sensor input like the Code.
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  #4  
Old 11-14-2019, 02:01 PM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Thanks c-attack,

I was stuck at the password thingy so could reply sooner.

I highly appreciate your reply with technical details yet very concise and precise.

The F does have a sensor probe in the form of a cable, I used one of those previously but need a quick glance to the manual for how to deploy it.

Thanks for explaining what the 3-pin is for and your suggestions regarding how to use the splitter. And great thanks for reminding me about the CPU_FAN and CPU_OPT, Asus technical support in the region I live in have no such knowledge about the headers.

I mentioned in my original post that there are 7 headers CPU_FAN, CPU_OPT, AIO_PUMP, CHA_FAN1, CHA_FAN2, W_PUMP+ and M.2_FAN. After you've explained about the functionality of the CPU_FAN and CPU_OPT I logically infer that the other headers must have their own characteristics and behaviours in response to current and temperature.

If I may ask, given that CPU_FAN and CPU_OPT are not recommended because of their over-sensitivity, can I arrange the two fans' control as follows:
Option A) still connect the two fan to CPU_FAN and CPU_OPT but set the curve to a constant value of 100%. Reason being, if connect them according to the manual, the two fans will set to run at 100% anyway, right, so why not just connect them directly to the two headers and set them via the bios/MB?
Option B) use CHA_FAN1 or CHA_FAN2 using a 4 pin PWM splitter and set a curve for them according to the CPU temperature?
The above 2 options must have their pro and con, which one would you recommend?

As to the 3 pin tachometer cable, if its purpose is to feed the rpm value to the BIOS, can I plug it into the AIO_PUMP header and set it to run 100% full speed?

Regarding iCUE, I am not refraining from using it. One reason is that I have also purchased your RMx 850W PSU, a rather powerful PSU and expensive and it also comes with a USB cable for monitoring control. So anyway I will have to use iCUE, also despite I am no big fan of RGB stuffs, I don't mind a bit of them as pump RGB is rather reasonable. Besides, I have purchased the MasterBox MB511 which comes with 3 RGB fans with separate RGB controller, the case will be like some circus stunt thing anyway.

The reason I want to keep the bios/MB is because I want to have more options, in case either one of them fail I still have another alternative there.
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  #5  
Old 11-14-2019, 06:25 PM
c-attack c-attack is online now
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Option A) CPU & OPT for radiator fans -> You can try this and if it turns out to be really over-reactive, then you know you need to plug them into a CHA fan header. You should have delay options up to 8 seconds or so (in the Advanced BIOS-> Qfan section). The complaint has always been that this gets ignored and finally it was revealed there are some hidden parameters that can trigger faster response. These may change each motherboard edition, so no way to be sure until you test. When on CPU/OPT, CPU temp is the only control option.

Option B) Either CHA fan header, but my first choice would be using a 10K themistor wire from the "temp sensor" two prong connection. You tape it above the radiator exhaust. This mimics coolant temp and now you have motherboard control from the right variable. However, if that is not desired, you should be able to use CPU temp on the CHA fan header without the additional fan triggers present on CPU and it's copycat OPT.

AIO, W_Pump, etc. are tricky and very MB model dependent. On some, you can undo the preset disable, but then it will only run from CPU temp. Several Asus Z390 boards now let you choose from the same variables as a CHA fan header, which is great since AIO and W_Pump used to be CHA 3,4,5, etc.

Tachometer wire from cooler -> This can go anywhere that is convenient. No special header required. No power delivered, so 100% fan setting not required. However, if you use the in BIOS "fan tuning" I have had it get stuck on fans with no control wire like that. If you set it to "disabled" or "full speed", the tuning program will skip right over it. No matter what, there is no control wire and thus it can do nothing to the cooler.

If you have to use iCUE anyway, you might want to give the H100i Platinum's fan controller a try. You will be able to access it from the desktop vs the BIOS. That will make finding your preferred fan range a lot easier. Also, you will be able to see coolant temp and thus have a better indicator if more/less fan speed is doing anything, or you are just spinning your wheels (fans). If you are opposed to running from coolant temperature and want to run from CPU temp for whatever reason, I do think the MB/BIOS fan headers have an advantage for this. Those are native sensors to the MB. iCUE must import that data from the MB. Of course the reverse is true for coolant temperature and that is the natural control variable for any water cooling system.
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  #6  
Old 11-14-2019, 11:59 PM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Deeply impressed by your great knowledge about the Asus board and the H100i PRO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
Option A) CPU & OPT for radiator fans -> You can try this and if it turns out to be really over-reactive, then you know you need to plug them into a CHA fan header. You should have delay options up to 8 seconds or so (in the Advanced BIOS-> Qfan section). The complaint has always been that this gets ignored and finally it was revealed there are some hidden parameters that can trigger faster response. These may change each motherboard edition, so no way to be sure until you test. When on CPU/OPT, CPU temp is the only control option.
I have just read some other threads on other forums saying that the reason the H100i PRO requires the Tachometer wire to be connected to CPU_FAN header is because only that header can detect CPU failure and temperature overheat, other headers won't do, is that the case?

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
Option B) Either CHA fan header, but my first choice would be using a 10K themistor wire from the "temp sensor" two prong connection. You tape it above the radiator exhaust. This mimics coolant temp and now you have motherboard control from the right variable. However, if that is not desired, you should be able to use CPU temp on the CHA fan header without the additional fan triggers present on CPU and it's copycat OPT.
10K themistor wire - Is that the one which comes with the Motherboard package?

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
AIO, W_Pump, etc. are tricky and very MB model dependent. On some, you can undo the preset disable, but then it will only run from CPU temp. Several Asus Z390 boards now let you choose from the same variables as a CHA fan header, which is great since AIO and W_Pump used to be CHA 3,4,5, etc.
If it was previously named as CHA_FAN3, 4, 5...etc then the fact eases my mind! It's just another control.

So is it true that CPU_FAN really is the only control which can detect CPU failure and overheat ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
Tachometer wire from cooler -> This can go anywhere that is convenient. No special header required. No power delivered, so 100% fan setting not required. However, if you use the in BIOS "fan tuning" I have had it get stuck on fans with no control wire like that. If you set it to "disabled" or "full speed", the tuning program will skip right over it. No matter what, there is no control wire and thus it can do nothing to the cooler.
Another relief!
It's a 3-pin anyway, it doesn't control the speed, it just feeds info to the bios.

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
If you have to use iCUE anyway, you might want to give the H100i Platinum's fan controller a try. You will be able to access it from the desktop vs the BIOS. That will make finding your preferred fan range a lot easier. Also, you will be able to see coolant temp and thus have a better indicator if more/less fan speed is doing anything, or you are just spinning your wheels (fans). If you are opposed to running from coolant temperature and want to run from CPU temp for whatever reason, I do think the MB/BIOS fan headers have an advantage for this. Those are native sensors to the MB. iCUE must import that data from the MB. Of course the reverse is true for coolant temperature and that is the natural control variable for any water cooling system.
Good to know that iCUE can even detect the fluid temperature, quite impressive actually. But getting this fan controller means investing more? I have already spent +$1,000 on the new rig, better consider it later.
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  #7  
Old 11-15-2019, 12:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baba Yetu VI View Post
I have just read some other threads on other forums saying that the reason the H100i PRO requires the Tachometer wire to be connected to CPU_FAN header is because only that header can detect CPU failure and temperature overheat, other headers won't do, is that the case?
I don't know where you are seeing this but it's flat out dead wrong. First, the H100i PRO doesn't require the tach wire to be connected anywhere. It's there to prevent a CPU_FAN warning. And ... uhh ... fan headers don't detect anything. They are controlled by the BIOS. Typically, CPU_FAN can only be controlled based on the CPU temp. But CPU failure and temperature overheat is detected by the thermal protection that's built into the CPU.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baba Yetu VI View Post
So is it true that CPU_FAN really is the only control which can detect CPU failure and overheat ?
See above. It's about what temperatures can be used to control the header. Again, CPU fan can typically only be controlled by CPU temp. But it varies by motherboard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baba Yetu VI View Post
Another relief!
It's a 3-pin anyway, it doesn't control the speed, it just feeds info to the bios.
Yup.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Baba Yetu VI View Post
Good to know that iCUE can even detect the fluid temperature, quite impressive actually. But getting this fan controller means investing more? I have already spent +$1,000 on the new rig, better consider it later.
The H100i has a fan controller built into it. It doesn't mean investing any more than you already have. The AIO FAQ has details on why using the fan controller on the pump is the better choice in the vast majority of installations.
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  #8  
Old 11-15-2019, 04:34 AM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevBiker View Post
I don't know where you are seeing this but it's flat out dead wrong. First, the H100i PRO doesn't require the tach wire to be connected anywhere. It's there to prevent a CPU_FAN warning. And ... uhh ... fan headers don't detect anything. They are controlled by the BIOS. Typically, CPU_FAN can only be controlled based on the CPU temp. But CPU failure and temperature overheat is detected by the thermal protection that's built into the CPU.


See above. It's about what temperatures can be used to control the header. Again, CPU fan can typically only be controlled by CPU temp. But it varies by motherboard.


Yup.


The H100i has a fan controller built into it. It doesn't mean investing any more than you already have. The AIO FAQ has details on why using the fan controller on the pump is the better choice in the vast majority of installations.
Many thanks DevBiker for your replies.
When c_attack said: "you might want to give the H100i Platinum's fan controller a try. You will be able to access it from the desktop vs the BIOS. That will make finding your preferred fan range a lot easier. Also, you will be able to see coolant temp and thus have a better indicator if more/less fan speed is doing anything, or you are just spinning your wheels (fans). If you are opposed to running from coolant temperature and want to run from CPU temp for whatever reason, I do think the MB/BIOS fan headers have an advantage for this."

Those are native sensors to the MB." How do I try out the Platinum fan controller?

My installation has been put on hold and I wish to proceed without further delay.

Could you confirm one more time that if both of the followings will work without damaging the pump and the fans and advise which plan is better for long term? I do not want to change the arrangement once that's installed.

Plan A
1) Connect the pump tachometer 3-pin to the CPU_FAN header.
2) Connect the two fans' connectors to OPT_FAN and CHA_FAN2 (because CHA_FAN1 is designated to the rear exhaust fan of the case)
3) Connect the USB cable to the pump and one of the 10-1 pins USB 2.0 header on the motherboard.
4) Leave the y-splitter from the pump without connecting anything to it.

Plan B
Connect everything according to the manual.

Lastly, I find moving the pump's orientation such that the "Corsair" logo is horizontally displayed without rotating it by 90 degrees or 180 degrees requires a bit more twisting it. I hold on doing that lest that will bend the tubes too much resulting in leaks. Are the tubes and the suctions to the pump capable of withstanding a bit more twisting force? If they can't I'll just leave that.
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Old 11-15-2019, 04:35 AM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevBiker View Post
I don't know where you are seeing this but it's flat out dead wrong.
I seek help from everywhere, and some replied me with the following advices:

"AIO systems introduce a small dilemma that mobo fan control systems did not anticipate, and there are various ways that these are handled. You also need to understand that the CPU_FAN and other headers have FOUR functions: provide power to the connected device; display the speed of that device; control the speed of that device; and, monitor that device's speed signal for FAILURE and take appropriate action if such failure is detected. For the CPU in particular, many mobos take quick and significant ation in the event of failure of CPU cooling, including immediate warning displays and often including rapid system shut-down even without waiting for the sensor inside the CPU chip to show high temps. In the case of AIO systems, there are two devices involved in CPU cooling - the pump and the rad fan(s). Of these, the PUMP is more important for failure monitoring because without that there is VERY LITTLE cooling, whereas failure of one or even all fans on the rad leaves some cooling working, just not enough.

The way Corsair's H100i system does these jobs is this. (And yes, this is different from the way their older H60 system did it.) There is a 3-pin connection from the PUMP to the mobo's CPU_FAN header which feeds the speed of the PUMP to that header where it can be monitored for FAILURE; it also is available for display and as info accessible by other systems. The pump gets all power for itself and the rad fans directly from the PSU via its SATA power input cable. The pump housing also contains all the circuitry to power and control the rad fans, and in this system there is NO mobo involvement in rad fan control. To do this you MUST connect the rad fans to the outputs from the PUMP unit. There is a cable connecting the pump to a mobo USB2 header, and that is the communication link between it and the iCue software utility that you must download and run. THAT utility will monitor and display the pump speed via the info it gets from the CPU_FAN header. It also completely takes over control, display and failure monitoring of the rad fan speeds, so that is the only place you can "see" those speeds. Control of CPU cooling is done solely by varying the speeds of the rad fans; the pump speed is usually full speed although some options may be available to you in iCue.

Your mobo has some fan headers suited to use with AIO systems that operate differently. The Corsair H100i system was designed for use even without those additional headers and does not require them."
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  #10  
Old 11-15-2019, 07:18 AM
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I think the debate is hinging around the word “required”. The cooler does not need the tach wire connected to function normally. The motherboard is slightly different. Nearly all MBs require some kind of functional device to be plugged into CPU fan or the system won’t boot. This is often referred to as “CPU boot error”. This goes back to how your standard and previously included with cpu air cooler works. You don’t want to boot up a pc with no active cooling and air towers need to be running their fan. On most motherboards this layer of protection can be defeated (Asus Advanced BIOS -> Monitor, scroll down to find the CPU fan “speed reading” RPM, click and select ignore. Warning system turned off. I run this way as there are no MB headers in use on my custom loop.

The value of this for you? If the cooler has some type of electrical failure on power on (the most likely time for any electronic device), you will get a bios error screen and know something has gone wrong. Without it, you would probably make it to Windows, hear the radiator fans running way too fast, and also know something is wrong. You may get shutdown or the system will shut you down when the cpu hits the limit and safety shutdown down. I think the general advice we give is it’s better to put the dummy speed wire on CPU fan if nothing is going to be there anyway. Obviously if there are fan wires there, the speed wire must go somewhere else. Depending on location, cpu fan may not be convenient (front radiator, etc). You can use anything, but something must be on cpu fan or you need to turn off the warning system.
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Old 11-15-2019, 07:32 AM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Thanks c_attack for your efforts to help.

I think I am going to choose the default option (the instruction manual) although the wiring will somehow destroys the tidiness. But as it is needed, I will certainly follow the default method plus the fact that now I know why things have to be connected as they should.
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Old 11-18-2019, 06:05 AM
Baba Yetu VI Baba Yetu VI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DevBiker View Post
I don't know where you are seeing this but it's flat out dead wrong. First, the H100i PRO doesn't require the tach wire to be connected anywhere. It's there to prevent a CPU_FAN warning. And ... uhh ... fan headers don't detect anything. They are controlled by the BIOS. Typically, CPU_FAN can only be controlled based on the CPU temp. But CPU failure and temperature overheat is detected by the thermal protection that's built into the CPU.


See above. It's about what temperatures can be used to control the header. Again, CPU fan can typically only be controlled by CPU temp. But it varies by motherboard.


Yup.


The H100i has a fan controller built into it. It doesn't mean investing any more than you already have. The AIO FAQ has details on why using the fan controller on the pump is the better choice in the vast majority of installations.
I have finally get the whole system up and running and iCUE is installed.

iCUE reports the temperature is 27C. Is it referring to the MB or the PUMP or the CPU?

Also, now I have a visual confirmation of what I imagined before. Despite the two PWM fans' headers are not connected to any fan header on the motherboard, their speeds are being reported from within iCUE, it's quite a magic.

The Quiet setting makes them running at high 900 rpm. As to the pump, it reports 2012 rmp something like that. My H60 1st gen had 4,000 rpm. Why the H100i being an advanced AIO has its pump running slower?
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  #13  
Old 11-18-2019, 08:18 AM
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The pump doesn't need to run as fast.
And the temperature reported is the temperature of the liquid in the system.
As for the fan header - the fan header doesn't detect anything. It's the BIOS that does that. It uses that fan header to protect the CPU but make no mistake - that's a functionality of the BIOS. And BIOSes can (and do) vary but they will monitor the tach input on the CPU_FAN header for zero RPM. Which is what your quoted post was trying to tell you. Note, however, that iCUE does not use the CPU_FAN header at all for monitoring the cooler - it uses the data from the USB connection exclusively. The connection for the CPU_FAN header is there only to keep your BIOS from displaying a CPU_FAN warning - and to provide shutdown in the event of a full pump failure. It serves no other purpose at all and is not required for proper function of the cooler itself.
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