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Old 08-30-2019, 08:39 AM
yoyoseby yoyoseby is offline
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Default H150i PRO question

I was thinking about buying this cooler but i've been doing some research first because I want to know for sure how to properly configure it. So what I've seen is that from the pump there are some cables going out: 3x 4-pin cables to connect the 3 ML fans that come with the cooler and one 3-pin cable to connect everything to the motherboard, and also the USB cable to use iCue. Here come my questions?
1) How exactly does this actually work?
2) If I connect them like this and connect the pin to one of my 4-pin mounts on the MOBO that, in BIOS, can be configured to switch it's RPM depending on the CPU temp, what will actually happen, will the BIOS identify the pump and fans combination and let me alter their curve, or they appear only in software, where I can use those 3 presets?
3) If, for example, I want to configure the pump via iCue and let it stay on the quiet profile ONLY, but also want the three fans to be operated from BIOS, to be able to modify their curve according to CPU temp, how can I actually do that?
4) What is the purpose of that 3-pin cable that's coming out of the pump, if I already have the USB cable that controls the pump and the fans?

On short, what I wish to do with this cooler is this: I wish to set the pump on a static RPM, for example Quiet mode in iCue, and the fans mounted on the radiator to be controled from BIOS and automatically adjust the RPM, because i'm gonna mount 3 more fans to make it push-pull config. and I want all 6 fans to be automatically adjusted in correlation with the CPU temp via BIOS, so that's all.

I hope my concerns can be understood.

Last edited by yoyoseby; 08-30-2019 at 10:05 AM.
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  #2  
Old 08-30-2019, 10:06 AM
Yemble Yemble is offline
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Originally Posted by yoyoseby View Post
I was thinking about buying this cooler but i've been doing some research first because I want to know for sure how to properly configure it. So what I've seen is that from the pump there are some cables going out: 3x 4-pin cables to connect the 3 ML fans that come with the cooler and one 3-pin cable to connect everything to the motherboard, and also the USB cable to use iCue. Here come my questions?
1) How exactly does this actually work?
2) If I connect them like this and connect the pin to one of my 4-pin mounts on the MOBO that, in BIOS, can be configured to switch it's RPM depending on the CPU temp, what will actually happen, will the BIOS identify the pump and fans combination and let me alter their curve, or they appear only in software, where I can use those 3 presets?
3) If, for example, I want to configure the pump via iCue and let it stay on the quiet profile ONLY, but also want the three fans to be operated from BIOS, to be able to modify their curve according to CPU temp, how can I actually do that?
4) What is the purpose of that 3-pin cable that's coming out of the pump, if I already have the USB cable that controls the pump and the fans?

I hope my concerns can be understood.
I have a H115i PRO which has similar cabling...

The 3-pin cable from the pump plugs into your CPU fan header and is there solely to monitor the pump speed, independently of iCUE. It is not used to configure the pump speed, which is the job of the USB cable on the side of the pump head. This is what iCUE talks to.

The various fan cables and splitters are there to allow all your radiator fans to be connected to the pump head and then monitored via the USB. iCUE, not the BIOS, is used to set these fan profiles which are tagged to the radiator coolant temperature. Your BIOS knows nothing about the radiator coolant temperature, hence the need for iCUE to associate the fans with the coolant. Without iCUE present, the cooler will use its built in defaults for this "association".

If you add a second set of fans as push/pull, you can connect those to a separate mobo header, CPU_OPT in my case, and set profiles for those in your BIOS. I tag them to VRM.

Well that's my understanding anyway, based upon observation and some amount of tinkering. I'm sure that someone will correct me if I've got anything wrong

Last edited by Yemble; 08-30-2019 at 10:17 AM.
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  #3  
Old 08-30-2019, 11:28 AM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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The cable missing from your list is the SATA cable that provides power to the pump and fans. That will run back to the PSU directly. As mentioned, the 3 pin pump to the MB is a "dummy header" that reports pump speed on most models and will set off the CPU fan boot error if the pump did not start on power up. Aside from that, there is no BIOS control over the cooler. This is done through the software (iCUE) or in its absence the firmware in the cooler. Both will handle pump and fan speed changes.

You definitely do not want 6 fans on the radiator changing with CPU temperature. That is not how the cooling works and the end result would be a lot of needless fan speed changes on any CPU from 6700K on. Way too much dynamic temperature change. The CPU temp is the result of voltage + CPU construction + conductivity out through the lid/TIM/Cold Plate. Nothing you can do about that except change the voltage. All other aspects are more or less fixed rates of energy transfer. The cooler is the waste heat removal department. CPU dumps heat into the stream. Radiator and fans disperse it somewhere else. Fan and pump speed changes are only necessary when the coolant temperature changes, otherwise they have no effect. Take two identical CPUs and connect two different coolers to them -- one a little 120mm entry level model and the a massive custom fabricated 3 meter panel. Then set your voltage to something high like 1.50v (or anything else). When you initiate that 100% load, the CPU would have an identical temperature on each system for the first several seconds. The difference won't become apparent until minutes after when heat builds up faster in the 120mm system than its small radiator and single fan can expel. You then get a coolant temperature rise. Since coolant temperature is the minimum possible CPU temperature with zero volts, it is the baseline. This means a +7C coolant rise will result in +7 to the CPU than you would have had at the previous coolant temperature. The custom panel likely never changes coolant temp at all and is able to expel all the heat in the system in a single pass. That is not a realistic expectation in any personal computer, but does serve as an illustrative example.

You'll have to see on push-pull. You don't get a lot of return on the extra fans on 360mm radiators with medium or low fin density. There are exceptions where it might make sense, but we don't know what you are planning with case, radiator location, CPU, etc. It might be possible to run all 6 from the H150i controller, but it depends on fan current draw. Another solution is to use the Corsair Commander Pro, which is their 6 port fan controller that ties into the iCUE system and also doubles as the lighting interface, replacing the Lighting Node Pro required for the RGB fans. Note the standard fans on the H150i ARE NOT RGB or LED. Just grey.

Pump control for all Corsair coolers are static. The three presets correspond to fixed RPM settings. Quiet = 1100 rpm, Balanced 2160, and Extreme 2850 (+-30 rpm). Most people can put in on balanced and be done with it. You usually don't get much return on the highest speed in a short, low restriction loop like an AIO. In contrast, there is a point where the flow is too slow. The Quiet mode is quiet, but 1100 rpm will give you a definite temperature penalty at load. It is meant to be for quiet desktop work and it will do fine there. However, if you then immediately transition to load, you will be taking on a 6-10C penalty right from the start. It will eventually even out, but I would rather keep it on balanced and not have to do an extra 15 minutes of high speed fans when starting up. User choice.

Fan control is programmable and you can set a 6 point temp vs speed control curve.
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Old 08-30-2019, 03:37 PM
yoyoseby yoyoseby is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
The cable missing from your list is the SATA cable that provides power to the pump and fans. That will run back to the PSU directly. As mentioned, the 3 pin pump to the MB is a "dummy header" that reports pump speed on most models and will set off the CPU fan boot error if the pump did not start on power up. Aside from that, there is no BIOS control over the cooler. This is done through the software (iCUE) or in its absence the firmware in the cooler. Both will handle pump and fan speed changes.

You definitely do not want 6 fans on the radiator changing with CPU temperature. That is not how the cooling works and the end result would be a lot of needless fan speed changes on any CPU from 6700K on. Way too much dynamic temperature change. The CPU temp is the result of voltage + CPU construction + conductivity out through the lid/TIM/Cold Plate. Nothing you can do about that except change the voltage. All other aspects are more or less fixed rates of energy transfer. The cooler is the waste heat removal department. CPU dumps heat into the stream. Radiator and fans disperse it somewhere else. Fan and pump speed changes are only necessary when the coolant temperature changes, otherwise they have no effect. Take two identical CPUs and connect two different coolers to them -- one a little 120mm entry level model and the a massive custom fabricated 3 meter panel. Then set your voltage to something high like 1.50v (or anything else). When you initiate that 100% load, the CPU would have an identical temperature on each system for the first several seconds. The difference won't become apparent until minutes after when heat builds up faster in the 120mm system than its small radiator and single fan can expel. You then get a coolant temperature rise. Since coolant temperature is the minimum possible CPU temperature with zero volts, it is the baseline. This means a +7C coolant rise will result in +7 to the CPU than you would have had at the previous coolant temperature. The custom panel likely never changes coolant temp at all and is able to expel all the heat in the system in a single pass. That is not a realistic expectation in any personal computer, but does serve as an illustrative example.

You'll have to see on push-pull. You don't get a lot of return on the extra fans on 360mm radiators with medium or low fin density. There are exceptions where it might make sense, but we don't know what you are planning with case, radiator location, CPU, etc. It might be possible to run all 6 from the H150i controller, but it depends on fan current draw. Another solution is to use the Corsair Commander Pro, which is their 6 port fan controller that ties into the iCUE system and also doubles as the lighting interface, replacing the Lighting Node Pro required for the RGB fans. Note the standard fans on the H150i ARE NOT RGB or LED. Just grey.

Pump control for all Corsair coolers are static. The three presets correspond to fixed RPM settings. Quiet = 1100 rpm, Balanced 2160, and Extreme 2850 (+-30 rpm). Most people can put in on balanced and be done with it. You usually don't get much return on the highest speed in a short, low restriction loop like an AIO. In contrast, there is a point where the flow is too slow. The Quiet mode is quiet, but 1100 rpm will give you a definite temperature penalty at load. It is meant to be for quiet desktop work and it will do fine there. However, if you then immediately transition to load, you will be taking on a 6-10C penalty right from the start. It will eventually even out, but I would rather keep it on balanced and not have to do an extra 15 minutes of high speed fans when starting up. User choice.

Fan control is programmable and you can set a 6 point temp vs speed control curve.
Okay so hear me out a little bit:
1) If that 3 pin header is dummy, what will it show when I go to BIOS??? Because after all it has to show something there, or at least that's what i'm thinking
2) You said that I wouldn't want to have fans constantly changing their RPM with CPU temp, but I wonder why you say that? I want to go push pull so I can add 3 HD fans for illumination also, my MOBO (Z390 gaming pro carbon) has 2 fan headers that can be configured from the bios to change with the CPU temperature so I was thinking to connect the 3 stock fans to one header and 3 HD to another header so all 6 change with CPU temperature, because, by my logic, if I leave the pump and the 3 stock on a locked RPM, if I put 3 HD on the back of the radiator, I don't think i'm going to get anything from it as the first 3 stock fans that are the intake fans, or I'm getting something wrong??

Last edited by yoyoseby; 08-30-2019 at 04:01 PM.
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  #5  
Old 08-30-2019, 08:06 PM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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1) On Pro models it will show the pump speed to the BIOS, but it is not controllable hence the "dummy" tag.

2) If you want to go push-pull for aesthetic reasons, by all means go ahead. That is one of the few reasons for it. Performance is not. However, re-read the section about how the cooler works. You don't want the radiator fans on CPU temp control because they will change their speed every second, every moment of the day until you pull all your hair out. Also, the cooling process does not work that way, so all that extra fan speed is wasted noise.

The H150i will have a 3 way powered fan splitter. Most definitely three fans should go there. Depending on what fans you use, you might be able to run dual PWM splitters from each of those for 6 in total. If not, you probably want a Commander Pro to all of the fan control into the iCUE software and off the BIOS. You will have to run iCUE anyway for the cooler.
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Old 08-31-2019, 02:15 AM
yoyoseby yoyoseby is offline
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Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
1) On Pro models it will show the pump speed to the BIOS, but it is not controllable hence the "dummy" tag.

2) If you want to go push-pull for aesthetic reasons, by all means go ahead. That is one of the few reasons for it. Performance is not. However, re-read the section about how the cooler works. You don't want the radiator fans on CPU temp control because they will change their speed every second, every moment of the day until you pull all your hair out. Also, the cooling process does not work that way, so all that extra fan speed is wasted noise.

The H150i will have a 3 way powered fan splitter. Most definitely three fans should go there. Depending on what fans you use, you might be able to run dual PWM splitters from each of those for 6 in total. If not, you probably want a Commander Pro to all of the fan control into the iCUE software and off the BIOS. You will have to run iCUE anyway for the cooler.
Okay I get it now, I think I understood everything with the 3-pin cable and why you don't suggest me going CPU temp related with all the fans, although I think I will try using 3 fans mounted on the splitter from the pump and then also try it using CPU temp just to check it out, currently my R1 Universal has its 2 fans seted on CPU temp and it doesn't change that RPM that much tho, in terms of range, for example when i'm just wondering through BIOS, the fans are between 1000 and 1150 all the time, true that never just stay on one speed but I have no accustic problems as you said.
Also I read somewhere on this forum that it will blow up the pump if you use splitters on the pump splitter to have for example 6 fans connected to the pump controller.
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Old 08-31-2019, 04:13 AM
Yemble Yemble is offline
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Originally Posted by yoyoseby View Post
Okay I get it now, I think I understood everything with the 3-pin cable and why you don't suggest me going CPU temp related with all the fans, although I think I will try using 3 fans mounted on the splitter from the pump and then also try it using CPU temp just to check it out, currently my R1 Universal has its 2 fans seted on CPU temp and it doesn't change that RPM that much tho, in terms of range, for example when i'm just wondering through BIOS, the fans are between 1000 and 1150 all the time, true that never just stay on one speed but I have no accustic problems as you said.
Also I read somewhere on this forum that it will blow up the pump if you use splitters on the pump splitter to have for example 6 fans connected to the pump controller.
As I said in my post above, I found that the best measure for setting a fan profile for a second set of fans via a mobo header, is the VRM temp. Definitely do not use the CPU temp. the VRM temp rises steadily with load, in a similar fashion to the coolant temp, whereas the CPU temp rises and falls at a rapid rate all of the time. It is pretty easy to get a close match between the stock fan speeds, tagged to coolant temp, and the additional fan speeds, when the latter are tagged to the VRM temp.

You do not need a CoPro to do any of this, as this is just introduces an unnecessary single point of failure, IMHO.

Last edited by Yemble; 08-31-2019 at 04:28 AM.
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Old 08-31-2019, 07:33 AM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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It might be possible to run all 6 from the H150i controller, but it depends on fan current draw. Another solution is to use the Corsair Commander Pro, which is their 6 port fan controller that ties into the iCUE system and also doubles as the lighting interface, replacing the Lighting Node Pro required for the RGB fans. Note the standard fans on the H150i ARE NOT RGB or LED. Just grey.
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoyoseby View Post
Also I read somewhere on this forum that it will blow up the pump if you use splitters on the pump splitter to have for example 6 fans connected to the pump controller.

As mentioned, it will depend on the current draw. You have about 1.5A to play with on pump's controller, so something like 6 ML fans is a safe bet. 6 high current fans would not be a good idea and I probably would not risk 6 x LL@0.30A each. This is a specific value per fan you need to calculate.

Yes, VRM temperature control from the motherboard can work.... when it's available which is getting to be rare except on HEDT boards. Asus seems to have gone to great pains to hide the VRM value and I have three high end boards from them where you can't even see it, let alone use it for fan control. Another possibility is if your board has a Temp sensor input that also shows up as a fan control option. That is the best one yet and you can run the cheap 10K thermistor wire to the exhaust side of the H150i radiator. Exhaust temp will be approximately equal to coolant temperature and that will allow you to match speeds fairly easily. Also keep in mind you still need to have either a LNP or Commander Pro if you are doing RGB fans, so it may not be overly productive to find an intricate way to bypass the native control features of the two devices. We have no idea what board or chipset you are planning, so we are just throwing ideas around at this point.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:45 AM
yoyoseby yoyoseby is offline
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I'm using Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon with a 9700K OC'd to 4,9 ghz, and in my bios I can see 2 fan headers that can be set to auto dependent on the CPU temp (which you guys suggested should do it on the second set of 3 fans) and 5 headers that can be set to auto dependent on the System temperature...now honestly I have no idea what this system temperature represents in reality.
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  #10  
Old 08-31-2019, 09:52 AM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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No, I am not suggesting you run 3 fans from the cooler and 3 from the motherboard via CPU temp. The one set will be relatively steady (all that is needed for radiator duty) and the other set will bouncing all over the place every time you open a folder, launch an application, or open a new tab in your browser. While it is not necessary to have the opposing sides be identical in fan speed, as they get further apart you will likely get some odd noises as the fans work against each other. When this happens, the slower set becomes resistance to the faster set.
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Old 08-31-2019, 09:59 AM
yoyoseby yoyoseby is offline
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No, I am not suggesting you run 3 fans from the cooler and 3 from the motherboard via CPU temp. The one set will be relatively steady (all that is needed for radiator duty) and the other set will bouncing all over the place every time you open a folder, launch an application, or open a new tab in your browser. While it is not necessary to have the opposing sides be identical in fan speed, as they get further apart you will likely get some odd noises as the fans work against each other. When this happens, the slower set becomes resistance to the faster set.
Exactly, so what should I actually do in this case?
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Old 08-31-2019, 10:17 AM
Yemble Yemble is offline
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Yes, VRM temperature control from the motherboard can work.... when it's available which is getting to be rare except on HEDT boards. Asus seems to have gone to great pains to hide the VRM value and I have three high end boards from them where you can't even see it, let alone use it for fan control
Really, I never realised that!!! So why do so many people opt for Asus mobos when overclocking? I have always bought Gigabyte mobos, primarily for the dual-BIOS feature, and fan control has never been an issue.
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Old 08-31-2019, 04:21 PM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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Really, I never realised that!!! So why do so many people opt for Asus mobos when overclocking? I have always bought Gigabyte mobos, primarily for the dual-BIOS feature, and fan control has never been an issue.
Excellent question. It is a very logical and useful control variable. Perhaps it reduces costs to exclude it. However, making it not visible in the BIOS at all is a very different thing. I can't think of any reasonable explanation for doing that.
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