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  #16  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:39 AM
Jackietools Jackietools is offline
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Did you have case sides on or off? And also are the fans now intake or exhaust?
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  #17  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skxc View Post
Case top off, everything else mounted

@idle
30~32C Package temp
24~30C Core Temp

in load temps go to around 40-45C

I'd say temperatures are a bit more stable, they don't vary as much, but honestly there's not much of a difference, even though I thought it would be.
I would not expect any better than that, regardless of case or cooler. In your screen shot, you had a H115i Temp (coolant temp) of 37C. That is on the upper end of load coolant temps for normal room temperature and certainly not acceptable for idle. If the coolant temp is 37C, than your baseline CPU core temps will also be around 37C. That puts you into a disadvantageous starting position and your then identical load temps would be in the upper 50's.


Don't run Prime95. Use AIDA or Intel XTU to start. They are both milder and serve the general purpose. However, in this situation I don't think there is a problem with either cooler and while you can certainly run CPU benchmarks, the more meaningful coolant temp data may come from actual use, whether that is gaming, rendering, encoding, or whatever you do. The GPU will affect the coolant temperature to some degree and that will need to be factored into any decision about where to put it and exhaust vs intake.
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  #18  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Jackietools View Post
It went down about 10 degrees for you if I am correct?.
Nope, temps went down for me after I inversed the fans and radiator (their position in the case, not the air flow). After I removed the top there wasn't much of a difference.

Quote:
Did you have case sides on or off? And also are the fans now intake or exhaust?
Case sides on, front fans intake, back fan exhaust.

Last edited by skxc; 01-27-2017 at 10:50 AM.
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  #19  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:48 AM
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Sorry I meant the radiator fans. are they set as exhaust or intake. Thanks
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  #20  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:50 AM
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They're set as exhaust.
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  #21  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:51 AM
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Default Coolant temp

If this is the actual temp we should judge the pumps effectiveness how does this look at in a 72F room at idle. Some minor programs running Utorrent, internet, etc)
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  #22  
Old 01-27-2017, 10:52 AM
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Mine too. Thanks
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  #23  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:06 AM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackietools View Post
If this is the actual temp we should judge the pumps effectiveness how does this look at in a 72F room at idle. Some minor programs running Utorrent, internet, etc)
Coolant temperature (H100i v2 or H115i Temp) is one of the data points to consider. When you spin the fans up, you can't cool the CPU directly. That is done at the cold plate and the ability to transfer heat from the CPU is down to the conductivity of the materials (CPU/TIM/Cold plate). The coolant then transports the heat to the radiator where it is expelled (hopefully). However, heat travels both ways across the cold plate, so your coolant temperature effectively determines your minimum CPU temperature. If performing action "X" causes your CPU temp to rise +20C, the lower the coolant temp, the lower the final CPU temp (25+20C vs 35+20C). Your coolant temp cannot be below the room temperature and that (although more specifically local case ambient temperature) determines its baseline. You will always be 8C warmer for everything in a 28C room compared to a 20C room.

29C is certainly not a terrible coolant temp, unless it is 18C in your room. However, I am still more interested in how your actual use temps work out. In stock CPU settings and with C-states/EIST enabled, you will only put out a trickle of heat at idle. The temps should be good regardless. Whether they stay way when stressed and if the coolant is able to come down in temp after are more telling questions. In the original screen shot, the coolant temp was 37C and that is much different.

SKXC had his radiator above the frame. I have not looked at the case manual nor do I have it for inspection. Is it necessary to put the fans or radiator above the frame? From the pictures, it looks like both would fit underneath, but that is often misleading.
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  #24  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
I would not expect any better than that, regardless of case or cooler. In your screen shot, you had a H115i Temp (coolant temp) of 37C. That is on the upper end of load coolant temps for normal room temperature and certainly not acceptable for idle. If the coolant temp is 37C, than your baseline CPU core temps will also be around 37C. That puts you into a disadvantageous starting position and your then identical load temps would be in the upper 50's.


Don't run Prime95. Use AIDA or Intel XTU to start. They are both milder and serve the general purpose. However, in this situation I don't think there is a problem with either cooler and while you can certainly run CPU benchmarks, the more meaningful coolant temp data may come from actual use, whether that is gaming, rendering, encoding, or whatever you do. The GPU will affect the coolant temperature to some degree and that will need to be factored into any decision about where to put it and exhaust vs intake.
Looks like a 75C is kind of high is it not?
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  #25  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:15 AM
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Two stress tests with Intel XTU, 5 min each:

Test1
CL4 - custom fan speed config
33% @30C
40% @40C
50% @50C
65% @66C
CPU Package Temp - 53C max.

---

Test2
CL4 - performance config preset
100% @40C
CPU Package Temp - 53C max.

In both tests H115i temp was ~34C.

I'm pleased with these results as now I can keep the PC pretty quiet, fans running @ 33-50%.

Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
SKXC had his radiator above the frame. I have not looked at the case manual nor do I have it for inspection. Is it necessary to put the fans or radiator above the frame? From the pictures, it looks like both would fit underneath, but that is often misleading.
The radiator above the frame is what caused the high coolant temperature for me, after I moved it inside the frame (with fans mounted above the frame) it dropped, it's now usually close to the CPU temp +/- 2-3 degrees.

Both do not fit underneath unfortunately they push into a motherboard cooler plate. The case is very modular though and I could move the motherboard down 5-10CM, but that would really squish my cable management setup.
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  #26  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:21 AM
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Originally Posted by skxc View Post
Both do not fit underneath unfortunately they push into a motherboard cooler plate. The case is very modular though and I could move the motherboard down 5-10CM, but that would really squish my cable management setup.
Thanks, that is what I was wondering about. Similar problem with SB800. While modular, it isn't always practical to shift it downwards. I think you are in a good temperature zone now and don't need to worry.
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  #27  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
I think you are in a good temperature zone now and don't need to worry.
Thanks for the confirmation!

@Jackietools my highest temp with the XTU benchmark was 57C, but I don't have my 6700 OC'ed, it runs at 4.0Ghz
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  #28  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:28 AM
Jackietools Jackietools is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
Coolant temperature (H100i v2 or H115i Temp) is one of the data points to consider. When you spin the fans up, you can't cool the CPU directly. That is done at the cold plate and the ability to transfer heat from the CPU is down to the conductivity of the materials (CPU/TIM/Cold plate). The coolant then transports the heat to the radiator where it is expelled (hopefully). However, heat travels both ways across the cold plate, so your coolant temperature effectively determines your minimum CPU temperature. If performing action "X" causes your CPU temp to rise +20C, the lower the coolant temp, the lower the final CPU temp (25+20C vs 35+20C). Your coolant temp cannot be below the room temperature and that (although more specifically local case ambient temperature) determines its baseline. You will always be 8C warmer for everything in a 28C room compared to a 20C room.

29C is certainly not a terrible coolant temp, unless it is 18C in your room. However, I am still more interested in how your actual use temps work out. In stock CPU settings and with C-states/EIST enabled, you will only put out a trickle of heat at idle. The temps should be good regardless. Whether they stay way when stressed and if the coolant is able to come down in temp after are more telling questions. In the original screen shot, the coolant temp was 37C and that is much different.

SKXC had his radiator above the frame. I have not looked at the case manual nor do I have it for inspection. Is it necessary to put the fans or radiator above the frame? From the pictures, it looks like both would fit underneath, but that is often misleading.
That was "skxc" who submitted the photo of coolant temp of 37. Mine is pretty steady at idle around 29-30. Exactly how should I set up the C-staes? Of course EIST is enabled but should I leave C state on Auto? Any help with these configs appreciated. As far as install "SKXC" had his radiator on top of the case. When the plastic top cover is put back on it would not allow much clearance between fans and cover to dissipate the heat. I believe the correct way is, as I have mine and "skxc" has now changed his is with the radiator mounted to underside of case with fans exhausting air out. Another idea is taking the CPU mount and resetting it with Arctic Silver instead of Corsair's generic paste. I don't want to be "flogging a dead horse" but I tend to be a perfectionist almost o a detriment. I really appreciate your help as well as everyones here. What about that 75 degree temp. Isn't that to high??
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  #29  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:30 AM
c-attack c-attack is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jackietools View Post
Looks like a 75C is kind of high is it not?
Don't run the benchmark. It is too peaky for meaningful data and it won't move the coolant temp even 1C. Instantaneous CPU core temps are mostly dependent on the voltage applied in that moment, the type of instruction, and the thermal transition through the CPU and cold plate. Cooler settings won't make a difference and the heat generated must always pass through the CPU before it enters the cooling system to be removed. I don't want to make any generalizations about how Kaby Lake CPUs behave under synthetic stress tests. However, they are likely to be similar to SkyLake and be very rangy under the auto volt stock conditions.

Instead of the benchmark, run a short 5 minute test. Before you do, go into the wrench settings and configure the display to show your 4 individual cores in the line graph. This is more useful than "CPU Temp" and can show odd behavior or sometimes mounting issues. The XTU graph will show your end CPU temps, but also note the starting and ending H100i v2 temperature. That will tell you how effective the cooler was at removing heat or whether it is 'stuck in the loop'.

EDIT: I know it was skyx's 37C, but that is the problem we are trying to address. Mounting position, fan positions and speeds will affect the coolant temperature. 29C coolant temp in 23C room is not terrible, but I would like to confirm it won't be compromised under load.

Tweaking your BIOS settings and overclock is something else. You don't need to change any of those at this point and it would be better if you didn't for comparison purposes. As for AS5 vs the stock paste, I don't think you will see any difference. AS5 is not exactly the top of the pile any more and there are some alternatives, but we are talking about 1-2C at most for a 95 TDW CPU. This can be done as some point down the line if you wish.

Last edited by c-attack; 01-27-2017 at 11:36 AM.
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  #30  
Old 01-27-2017, 11:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c-attack View Post
Don't run the benchmark. It is too peaky for meaningful data and it won't move the coolant temp even 1C. Instantaneous CPU core temps are mostly dependent on the voltage applied in that moment, the type of instruction, and the thermal transition through the CPU and cold plate. Cooler settings won't make a difference and the heat generated must always pass through the CPU before it enters the cooling system to be removed. I don't want to make any generalizations about how Kaby Lake CPUs behave under synthetic stress tests. However, they are likely to be similar to SkyLake and be very rangy under the auto volt stock conditions.

Instead of the benchmark, run a short 5 minute test. Before you do, go into the wrench settings and configure the display to show your 4 individual cores in the line graph. This is more useful than "CPU Temp" and can show odd behavior or sometimes mounting issues. The XTU graph will show your end CPU temps, but also note the starting and ending H100i v2 temperature. That will tell you how effective the cooler was at removing heat or whether it is 'stuck in the loop'.

EDIT: I know it was skyx's 37C, but that is the problem we are trying to address. Mounting position, fan positions and speeds will affect the coolant temperature. 29C coolant temp in 23C room is not terrible, but I would like to confirm it won't be compromised under load.

Tweaking your BIOS settings and overclock is something else. You don't need to change any of those at this point and it would be better if you didn't for comparison purposes. As for AS5 vs the stock paste, I don't think you will see any difference. AS5 is not exactly the top of the pile any more and there are some alternatives, but we are talking about 1-2C at most for a 95 TDW CPU. This can be done as some point down the line if you wish.
Just did another 5 minute test but set fans to performance in Corsair link and highest temp 72C was only 3 degrees cooler.. Last setting was on quiet, the fans run way too loud on performance. but my coolant temp went down to 29C immediately. Why wont the fans throttle down. May have to configure them manually. I am going to run it again using your advice. Thanks.
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