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  #1  
Old 10-30-2007, 04:19 PM
JSY JSY is offline
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Default Another TWIN2X4096-6400C5G and Asus Striker Extreme Thread...

TWIN2X4096-6400C5G

:)

I am having difficulty with the latency and voltage settings for my memory. Of all I've read here, it seems that it should be set to 5-5-5-18-2T and 2.0v. However the sticker on the modules themselves read 5-5-5-12, and I was wondering which one was right? Or is that why I've also read 5-5-5-15 as a compromise? I suspect that my settings may be causing a problem with stability. Either that, or perhaps my attempts to overclock the CPU to 3.66Ghz. :)

I've done a memtest on the modules but realize I have to do it again because I am not certain I turned USB Legacy off and also I used verson 3.3, and not the version 1.7. When I tried running a memtest with both modules overnight, though, I received 1 error and it's still running now while I'm at work.

Anyway, I guess I'm just trying to find something stable before trying to overclock anything, but so far - I have not been able to find any settings that won't give me a random crash (which is why I'm asking what the "standard" settings are) - and even everything set to "Auto" will not give me rock solid stability.

That is, I tried the Stability test in the Nvidia's nTest and while it appears that I can get through all the parts fine - it seems to always halt when I'm doing a stress test on the RAM. I also question the accuracy of Nvidia's Monitor application and CPU-Z program because the voltages detected always seem lower than what I set it up for.

I know I still have some homework to do, but just trying to find what settings the RAM should have has been work in itself. The brochure (for the DHX) say 5-5-5-18 v1.8. The sticker on the module says 5-5-5-12. A lot of threads here have come up with 5-5-5-15 2T.

Here's hoping that I'll find something stable and that my RAM is ok... (just like so many other Striker Extreme owners...lol)
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  #2  
Old 10-30-2007, 05:17 PM
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There are only a few stability tests I would use and Nvidia/Everest are not ones I would use.

Download CoreTemp - Information Regarding the VID and Thermal Output of Your CPUHere

Download Prime95 - The DeFacto Standard for testing a CPUs stability and this version is for the Quad CoreHere

The on motherboard memory controller (MCH - Northbridge) can not keep up with the extra DRAM at the rated 6400 speed. You will need to drop the speed of the DRAM from 800Mhz to 667Mhz. If you had purchased 4 X 1024MB of PC8500 (1066Mhz) DRAM, then you would have had to drop to PC6400 (800MHz) DRAM, etc. 2 X 2048 will not issue this problem. This is a problem of all 4 banks being populated.

Think of it this way. If you have a small phone book, then when you go into the index to find the page where you will find the phone number you are doing so at a certain speed due to the pages of the Index. Then you have to drive through the pages to get to the number. Now if your index is twice as large and the pages twice as many, then it takes longer to access the data. Now DRAM has a Strobe and the length of the strobe is how long the rows and columns can be left open before they must be refreshed. There is not enough time for the dram to be refreshed and then accessed with 4GB at the full access speed of the DRAM. The chipsets are optimized for 2GB, not 4GB and for 2 DRAM slots, not 4 DRAM slots populated. You can overclock the FSB (and hence the Memory Controller Hub = MCH) to gain some extra bandwidth and thus access the capabilities of the DRAM since the chipset is now clocked up. Usually when you clock up the FSB and concurrently the Memory Controller Hub (MCH) you need to raise the voltages of the CPU/MCH a bit as well.

Please download CoreTemp and let me know your VID and Idle temperatures of your CPU. What cooling are you using on your CPU?

I am certain we can help you gain a bit of an overclock to get your DRAM throughput higher and your CPU a bit faster. Since you already have a very quick Quad Core, high overclocks will not be necessary. For example, I have just put together a Q6600 (2.4GHz) with a very good aftermarket cooler (Thermalright Ultra 120 Xtreme) and overclocked it to 3.4Ghz. Now you are already at 3.0Ghz so a move to 3.4 is not nearly as high a move as the Q6600.

After you give me the required information I will help you with the overclock.

For DRAM Stability, Please enter your BIOS and set:
Quote:
Multiplier = 11
FSB = 333
DRAM = Unlinked and set to 667Mhz


Memory Timing
FSB - Memory Clock Mode: Unlinked
CPU FSB: 333
CPU Multi: 11
DDR FSB: 667
tCL: 5
tRCD: 5
tRP: 5
tRAS: 15
Advanced Memory Settings
tRRD: Auto
tRC: Auto
tWR: Auto
tWTR: Auto
tREF: Auto
Async Latency: Auto
CMD: 2T

CPU Spread Spectrum: Disabled
PCIE Spread Spectrum: Disabled
MCP PCIE Spread Spectrum: Disabled
SATA Spread Spectrum: Disabled
LDT Spread Spectrum: Disabled

CPU Internal Thermal Control: Enabled
Limit CPUID MaxVal: Enabled
Enhanced C1 (C1E): Enabled
Execute Disable Bit: Enabled
Virtualization Technology: Enabled
Enhanced Intel Speedstep Tech: Enabled
LDT Frequency: 5x

PCIEX16_1 Frequency (Mhz): 101
PCIEX16_2 Frequency (Mhz): 101
PCIEX16_3 Frequency (Mhz): 101
SPP<->MCP Ref Clock, Mhz: 201
Voltages
Vcore = 1.35v
Vdimm (DRAM Voltage) = 2.0v
1.2v HT: 1.3v
NB Vcore: 1.35v
SB Vcore: 1.50v
CPU VTT: 1.30v
Set to the above. Boot to the v1.7 Memtest and let run for 2 full passes. If you pass, then we can move to the overclock.
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  #3  
Old 10-30-2007, 07:13 PM
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Hi Derek,

Wow, thanks a lot for the useful information. I'll definitely do as you mentioned and let you know. That is a great analogy to make it a lot more understandable to me (yes, I'm sort of dense when it comes to memory latency and otherwise - I think my brain has a lot of latency). However, does the memory controller not being able to keep up at the rated 6400 speed hold true if I only have two slots populated? I have 2 x 2 GB modules in slots A1 and B1. The other two slots are empty. I am guessing that the 4GB total makes it true? I'll post the information you request when I get home tonight, but I can tell you that the CPU cooler is a Vigor Monsoon II.

Many thanks!

Joseph

Last edited by JSY; 10-30-2007 at 09:34 PM. Reason: Labeled the wrong DIMM slots!
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Old 10-31-2007, 10:17 AM
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Okay, the good news is that so far - after over 8 hours and 12 passes overnight using those parameters and with USB Legacy turned off, I've gotten no errors thus far (knock on wood). I'm letting it continue to run while I am in the office just to be sure that it is okay. With my old parameters using the old memtest, etc. - I ended up receiving about 11 errors and about 13 passes (which I guess makes 24 runs), so I just want to be sure that I've found some sort of DRAM stability.

I've run CoreTemp and here were there results while idle:

Tjunction: 100C
Core #0: 37C
Core #1: 39C
Core #2: 33C
Core #3: 33C

I noticed that the clock speed on the CPU is already at 3.66Ghz now, with the multiplier at 11x and the FSB at 333Mhz.

(however, when I checked with CPU-Z, it showed 3666.67 Ghz (407.41 x 9.0) - does it not know that the multiplier is unlocked on this CPU)

I also happened to run Nvidia's Monitor program and this alarmed me - it read my RAM voltage setting to be at 3.2v!! That's got to be wrong. The other day, it read what was set in the BIOS fine (1.9v), but I don't know if something happened after running PC Probe II (was giving me all sorts of errors the other night before I used your settings). It's readings of the other voltages (like CPU, etc.) seem to be fine. None of them were "red" to indicate a dangerous situation. But it looks like those values are supposed to indicate BIOS settings and not actual readings because they seem to be so static and not moving at all.

Oh well, here's hoping that it stays error free by this evening. Thanks for the insight and tips thus far!
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  #5  
Old 10-31-2007, 10:46 AM
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Hmmm, after reading some of these posts, should I have set the DDR FSB to 800Mhz since I only have 2 sticks (of 2GB each), before performing the memtest86+?

It's strange - I have this real big urge to find out whether or not I've received any errors but I'm at the office and not in front of my computer now. LOL!
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  #6  
Old 10-31-2007, 11:44 AM
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Yes, my mistake. With 2 X 2048 you should set to 800Mhz. I don't understand the long overnight memtests though. If you get passes with no errors and passes with errors then the issue would not seem to be DRAM. If you want to test for stability, you should NOT test with an overclock. Test with the CPU at stock and the DRAM at 800Mhz. The issue could easily be your oveclock allowing a bit flip transmission error, and especially so in many many passes like you are doing.

If you find errors at stock with 800mhz on the dram, then there is a problem. If you do not find errors at stock and only when you overclock the CPU, then your overclock needs to be looked at for stability.

Last edited by DerekT; 10-31-2007 at 11:49 AM.
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Old 10-31-2007, 12:33 PM
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Hmm, good point - I don't know, it seems to take about 2 hrs for 2 passes I think, and by the time I got home last night, it was so late that I thought I'd just do it and go to bed. I decided to just let it run while I was the office, but see that it looks unnecessary. I'll get home earlier today and try testing for 2 passes at 800Mhz.

I'm sorry, but with your earlier parameters that you set above, I thought you had wanted me to test for DRAM stability while OC'd (with the multiplier at 11).

Should I then throttle the multiplier back to 9 (stock) when doing the two passes, because the settings at 11 with the FSB at 333 is bringing the clock speed to 3.66Ghz. Once I can establish stability at that level in memtest, should I then bring the multiplier back to 11 with the RAM Unlinked at 800Mhz and then memtest that?

For some strange reason, my brain always thought that memtest should be done for hours but I see that that may not necessarily be the case.

Thanks again... If I can achieve stability at 3.66Ghz, I'd be thrilled enough. More would be cake, but I don't want to overstep my bounds and not so sure that I would have sufficient cooling beyond that anyway.

:)
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Old 10-31-2007, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JSY View Post
Hmm, good point - I don't know, it seems to take about 2 hrs for 2 passes I think, and by the time I got home last night, it was so late that I thought I'd just do it and go to bed. I decided to just let it run while I was the office, but see that it looks unnecessary. I'll get home earlier today and try testing for 2 passes at 800Mhz.

I'm sorry, but with your earlier parameters that you set above, I thought you had wanted me to test for DRAM stability while OC'd (with the multiplier at 11).
That was before I realized that you were not running with 4 sticks. Just a simple quick two passes at stock to be certain that your DRAM works at 800Mhz and a stock CPU.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSY View Post
Should I then throttle the multiplier back to 9 (stock) when doing the two passes, because the settings at 11 with the FSB at 333 is bringing the clock speed to 3.66Ghz. Once I can establish stability at that level in memtest, should I then bring the multiplier back to 11 with the RAM Unlinked at 800Mhz and then memtest that?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JSY View Post
For some strange reason, my brain always thought that memtest should be done for hours but I see that that may not necessarily be the case.
It should not hurt it if you are not pumping a lot of volts through it. It is fine. I just thought that you meant to test for that many passes and 2 passes is enough, 4 if you really want to test. Here's the thing, if you get errors on one pass and none on another pass, then the system has issues. That is the reason for 2 passes. To eliminate the possibility of system errors. DRAM is static. There are no operations created in DRAM, just storage commands and so either it is stable or it isn't.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSY View Post
Thanks again... If I can achieve stability at 3.66Ghz, I'd be thrilled enough. More would be cake, but I don't want to overstep my bounds and not so sure that I would have sufficient cooling beyond that anyway.)
I think you have a very good chance of 3.66 with that setup. Can't see why not. I know that 3.6 needs some very good cooling. 3.4 and good air is normal. 3.6 on good air is a great Quad and pretty much anything else needs water or better.
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  #9  
Old 10-31-2007, 09:43 PM
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Ok, well good news - after 23 passes and no fails. HAHA - so, I dropped the multiplier down to 9 and tested at 800Mhz memory and passed 2 times without error. I then pushed the multiplier back up to 11 and tested at 800Mhz memory and also passed 2 times without error. Hopefully this is promising. Any tips on what do next? Should I start to disable/enable some of the options in BIOS that I had done prior to this test? I am at 3.66Ghz but I am thinking some of those options in BIOS is holding me back (Speedstep?) that even though the clock shows 3.66, that it really isn't at it's potential? I fooled around with the 3DMark06 and noticed that my score is lower than it was prior to all of these tests when I was fooling around at 3.66Ghz (thought stability might have been an issue). Thanks!


EDIT: Well perhps I spoke a bit too soon. My system halted while in Warcraft. I thought I'd give it a spin and while everything looks ok in Vista, the halting in a game makes me wonder if I don't have issues elsewhere. Hmmm... or perhaps it's software related unless I can dupicate halting doing something else.

Last edited by JSY; 10-31-2007 at 09:58 PM. Reason: Added more information...
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Old 10-31-2007, 10:07 PM
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I gave you links to Core Temp and prime95. You need to follow this tutorial to get Core Temp to run in VISTA:

http://www.alcpu.com/forums/viewtopi...f75a8f4b8b6e62

Then when Core Temp is running. Start Prime95 and allow it to run for ~ 8 hours. You do not want to go over ~70C so if you find yourself going over, then you need to drop your overclock.

You have tested your DRAM to be stable but you have NOT tested your CPU to be stable. That's the next step. Set your DRAM to 800Mhz and test with Prime. You only need to test with 2 Passes of Memtest for DRAM error returns. You can also run for 5+ passes to test the ability of your system and the DRAM to radiate and remove the thermal output of the DRAM.

Test you CPU. What are Prime95 Load temps after 10min? After 1 hour. You can use your system while you Prime.
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  #11  
Old 11-01-2007, 10:35 AM
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Thanks for clarifying that. I got a way ahead of myself and my news is not that good. I have some obvious issues and as much as I'd love to let you know my core temps after 10 mins and 1 hour of running Prime95, I can't because Prime95 GETS AN ERROR WITHIN 3-4 MINUTES OF TESTING AND HALTS! Lol - hahaha, sorry, but it's gotten amusing on this and I am thisclose to RMAing the CPU/motherboard since I only have 2 weeks left to do it for a refund. :)

Anyway, doing exactly what you had mentioned above, my coretemps do indeed immediately increase after I run Prime95, but Core#1 gets to as much as 51C while Core #0, #2, and #3 stick around 45C+ and then each working thread starts to fail with the dreaded Rounding and hardware problem detected message - usually within 4 minutes or so.

I've decided to pull my multiplier back to 10 (for 3.33Ghz) and same thing. I then pulled it back to 9 for 3.0Ghz, and I also received the same results. I loaded default setup in the BIOS and tried to set it to stock, and I think Prime95 halted even quicker than previous.

I tried different scenarios and I even tried to increase the voltage a little to the CPU when it was multiplied by 11 and that didn't give me different results. For some reason, Prime95 is adverse to my computer and I suspect that it's a hardware issue regarding my CPU/motherboard. If I can't even seem to run Prime95 at stock then I think I have some serious issues.

At least I am pretty positive it's not the RAM. :)

But if I don't clear this up and am unable to run Prime95 though more than 2 or 3 tests for each working thread over this next day or two - then I think I'll have to send this thing back just to be sure I am within the 30 day policy of where I purchased it from.

Eh, what a shame - I really liked this setup, too - but what's the point if I can't get it stabilized.

Thanks for you help thus far. I'm still open to any suggestions of course but not being able to run Prime95 for 5 mins, much less 10, on any BIOS setting that I've tried has soured me on the state of my hardware!
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  #12  
Old 11-01-2007, 12:46 PM
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What BIOS version do you have installed and have you tried to simplify the system just one Video Card and no Sound Card?
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Old 11-01-2007, 02:07 PM
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Hi RamGuy,

I have BIOS 1305 installed, and you know what - and you know, I have not tried that (removing the sound and video card), but I will now. :)

I also noticed something that may be of note - the voltages in the voltage monitor in the BIOS always seem to show an amount lesser than the set amount. For example, I think for +12, it shows a reading of like +11.6 and +5 showed a reading of like +4.7. Just doing this from memory, but I wonder if that is indicative of a problem of not supplying enough power too.

One step at a time, I suppose. :) Will check out if it runs with the simpler setup.


Joseph
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Old 11-01-2007, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
I also noticed something that may be of note - the voltages in the voltage monitor in the BIOS always seem to show an amount lesser than the set amount. For example, I think for +12, it shows a reading of like +11.6 and +5 showed a reading of like +4.7. Just doing this from memory, but I wonder if that is indicative of a problem of not supplying enough power too.
Normally that would suggest the PSU has enough power, if they were high and not stable would suggest a week PSU.
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Old 11-03-2007, 02:08 AM
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I pulled one of the video cards out and tried the test again, and you know what - the Prime95 seemed to run - at least through the first test and for over 10 mins before I stopped it. This was a lot better than the 4-5 minute average that I was getting before it halted on me when I had both video cards in there. Looks like I might be homing in on what the issue is. I'm not sure I'll like what I find if it ends up being bad hardware in terms of the video card or the motherboard. I'm inclined to think it's a video card (or other card) issue since this motherboard is the second motherboard I'm working off of (just got it last week after RMAing the first one). But, thanks a bunch for the suggestion. I hope it's more of an nVidia SLI driver issue....

Regardless, at least I found something to work on. :)
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