HX series cooling design flaw (revving fan)

Lets start with a ‘Hello everyone’ in my first post on this forum :):

Short description of the issue to determine if your issue is the same:

1) fan is off due to small/moderate load

2) fan starts

3) spin's up to full/high speed producing large amounts of airflow and noise

4) fan slowly stops

5) repeats every 5 ~10 minutes (depends on model and ambient temp)

Just to clarify, it is not a buzzing/electrical noise. It's clearly air rushing through the PSU.

Possible things to test:

Improve airflow:

1) If there is a dust filter at the intake, remove it and see if the problem still occurs

2) If the PSU is bottom mounted 'lift' the case so the PSU has more room to breath.

If the above solution didn't help for you contact Corsair support. After reading comments like "it's supposed to work like that" I got a bit skeptical and upset. However, from personal experience I can now say that Corsair support did resolve the issue perfectly for me. I've bought numerous components from Corsair and I will surely do so again. Give support a chance to fix the issue, and you will be just as happy again with Corsair as I am.

I was wrong about the assumptions I made about Corsair and support, and I want to thank everyone for their support on this matter.

Keep calm, contact support, be happy again.

Personal background story:

About a month ago I got and installed a new HX1050 PSU. It was nicely packaged and installation was without problems. My pc booted nicely and all voltages reported in the BIOS were perfectly fine.

However…

After applying a moderate load due to heavy powerpoint presentations, I noticed a fan revving up to full speed and slowing down again. (does this problem sound familiar?). This happened again and again with 5~10 minutes intervals. This is annoying and a problem. It is perfectly acceptable that the fan spins up when the load or temperature increases. But an airplane taking off….

So after contacting Corsair support, an RMA (ticket: 6011022) was arranged and the unit was returned (the person I talked with genuinely did a good job, very pleased with that). After a few days I received a brand new sealed unit that should have no issues. After installing and doing some testing, the same problem returned plus a bonus: a component inside the unit resonates when the fan is running at a certain speed. So now I have a PSU with problematic fan control issues and buzzing at certain fan speeds…

After digging around the forum I found more and more people with the same issues, the majority being with the HX series and a group of hx1050 in particular. It appears to be a design choice…

Forum threads:

HX650:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=118267

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=116281&highlight=hx650+fan

HX750:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=115839&highlight=hx650+fan

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=113662&highlight=hx650+fan

HX1050:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=118022&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=117940&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=116471&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=117267&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=117006&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=114210&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=114270&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=113091&highlight=hx1050

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=113404&highlight=hx1050

First: september 2012:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=110517&highlight=hx1050

Some might consider it normal that the fan spins up to full speed and slows down again because a certain threshold isn’t met, but this is most certainly not normal + the box clearly shows a steady increase in noise production. Other PSU series from corsair do not show this behavior. The HX1050 was supposed to replace the tx650 (from 2007) in my pc, yet this 6 year old PSU performs better than the hx1050. For comparison, a €35 PSU (yes it has no brand and I use it for emergencies) is quieter.

It appears that the PWM controller is bugged, or maybe (if they thought of using it) the PID controller is incorrectly implemented explaining the silly fan control.

This clearly cannot be a correct design choice and the box does not give correct information about the PSU’s characteristics. Basically Corsair has 1 choice to make:

1. Target the PSU at flight sim enthusiast, remove the ‘professional’ label and correct the noise graph.

Or:

2. Actually fix the PSU’s so they work as described on the box

I’m quit disappointed that customer service didn’t bother to check the unit before shipping it to me. I’m not willing to send the unit (on my cost) to corsair again to have it replaced with another dying airplane,, uhh,, psu. It takes quite some time to contact RMA, get the details, remove PSU from PC, ship it, receive it again, install it again, all to find out the problem hasn’t been fixed. It’s understandable that some units fail, but once a structural problem has been found, do something about it…

What possible options do I have to actually have this unit fixed? Make my own PWM controller using a basic MCU to make my own cooling behavior (and void the excellent and very useful 7 year warranty). OR, try another RMA… (not going to happen). I have never had problems with my corsair RAM and SSD, but this PSU is a pain in the behind, and the 7 year warranty, I quote from the box:

“This kind of rigorous engineering is why the HX series carries a seven year warranty one of the industry’s best’ isn’t so super duper if it’s flawed by design.

Some more reference threads which show similar problems and possible solutions (06 - 04 -2013):

HX750:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=118929

HX850:

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=118876

Are there other users that have the same fan behavior and do you think its acceptable? Do you have a solutions for this (please :biggrin:)? Let's discuss:

drkoster, I'm sorry you have had trouble with your PSU. I understand how frustrating it is. I had the same sort of issue with a competitors unit before the one I am using know.

I’m quit disappointed that customer service didn’t bother to check the unit before shipping it to me. I’m not willing to send the unit (on my cost) to corsair again to have it replaced with another dying airplane,, uhh,, psu. It takes quite some time to contact RMA,

 

They usually don't test PSU's before sending them out. There would just about be impossible to test every PSU they send out on an RMA. 99.9% of the time they just send out a brand new unit . Mostly because most of the time that is the end of it. Sending a new unit vs a refurbed almost guarantees that a customer wouldn't have a repeat situation and they avoid multiple RMA's, 2)

I included a document with the RMA unit that contains graphs to explain the problem, and nobody from corsair took a look at it… Simply ship a new one and that’s it.

They receive pallets of returns at a time and most of the RMA system is automated unless you call them.So when you send a PSU in for RMA they are not just recieveing one piece at a time. Then they are shipped directly back to the factory for analysis. Sometimes Corsair will specifically set up special RMA procedures to have some PSU sent diectly to their office so they can test it in house. But not all of them are tested in their lab.

You can use the email system, but it is far faster to just pick up the phone and talk to a live person. However you can request specifically that they test your replacement before sending it out.

Since this would be a second PSU that you would need RMA'd Corasir will pick up the shipping both ways for you. I would really suggest you call them with your previous RMA number and let them know of the problems your experiencing.

Please keep in mind even though you have found quite a few threads on the same issue, Corsair sells right around 100,000 PSU's monthly. So the actual amount of faulty PSU's is quite low. Why some users have multiple problems is beyond me. But there are so may variables it could be any number of things. And sometimes components just clash no matter how good they are supposed to be.

But at any rate I would call them on Monday (they are closed o the weekends)and give them a chance to work this out for you. But don't wait on the automated system for this sort of issue.

If you happen to be out of the US or overseas, you can use SKYPE to make the call to the toll free number for nothing. The contact number is on the main website page at the bottom under Company>Contact.

Thank you for the reply peanutz94, your advice is much appreciated.

I used to work in an electronics store, if a customer had a damaged/incomplete product, it was policy to show the customer in the store that the new unit did not have the same issues and contained everything in the box. I assumed it was a normal way of processing warranties or incomplete products.

I shipped the RMA with a detailed explanation of the problem and didn't just say: ‘it’s is broken, go fix it for me!' kind of letter. That's kind of the frustrating part of this RMA process.

I am not convinced that receiving another new hx1050 will solve the problem. I can't return it to the store because I first contacted corsair as I assumed it was just a production error. There is a 2 weeks return if not satisfied policy for web shops in the Netherlands. Does Corsair accept exchanging for a different model (with financial compensation for the difference between the models)?.

I have used/ and will probably keep using corsair's RAM, SSD's and PSU's, and I will give it another go to have this situation resolved. But the way the RMA process currently is, it can take weeks or months before corsair finds structural problems with units and only if 1000's of PSU come back. Most users don't know or care about this community, are unable to correctly describe the problem, or language barriers that make it impossible to contact Corsair altogether. A single forum thread can represent hundreds or maybe even a thousand users with the same problem.

I will contact corsair again and ask for possible solutions.

Thanks again peanutz94, any help is always much appreciated.

Your stuck it with 7 years, you just have to deal with it. You can buy proper one for your suits and sell/forget the HX.

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/893-3/alimentations.html

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/881-3/alimentations.html

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/862-3/alimentations.html

http://www.hardware.fr/articles/810-3/alimentations.html

Doesnt show total truth , but should give some idea about return rates.

@drkoster :>>> Agreee , HX is marketed as some sort of PRO product and priced accordingly.

@peanutz94 , your sorta right there, more you sell more changes of bad products. That's not really the case tho if your products are good. Or are you saying like example many iPhones must be bad because they sold so well? Or try selling milk, more you sell more changes of bad milk? Does it go for beer too? I'd say it's quality control not quantity.

Corsairs support is good , not sure about product quality tho. They just keep denying, it's a common policy tho. Most companys do that.

@drkoster

I used to work in an electronics store, if a customer had a damaged/incomplete product, it was policy to show the customer in the store that the new unit did not have the same issues and contained everything in the box. I assumed it was a normal way of processing warranties or incomplete products.

Yeah, but again, you have to remember a computer store is a long way fro the thousands of RMA's they process daily. This is why in 99.9% of the time they will send a brand new unit instead of a refurbed. The odds are still withthem that the customer would get a properly functioning product. And in 99.9% of the time the issue is fixed and forgotten. But then there are the few that have multiple issues. And for the life of me I don't understand. And some people have great results????

@peanutz94 , your sorta right there, more you sell more changes of bad products. That's not really the case tho if your products are good. Or are you saying like example many iPhones must be bad because they sold so well? Or try selling milk, more you sell more changes of bad milk? Does it go for beer too? I'd say it's quality control not quantity.

Except milk can't be drop kicked,thrown, subjected to extreme temps,static electricity,ect while in shipping. I know for a fact that every PSU is tested on a PSU tester before it leaves the factory. Thats been stated here many times. What happens to it after that is anyone's guess.

And not all these RMA's would be for recent , but legacy products from around the world. So yeah, the more you sell the more your going to have to return. The postman just isn't trickling in with one or two psu's under his arm every day. And if you think milk doesn't have an return rate...call your local dairy! Besides, that's what they use to make chocolate milk and cottage cheese!:p:

What about the beer ? Still its more to do with quality than quantity. Maybe they got quality control covered then, but it obviously has some flaws.

You can decipher that out of those return statistics, check the HX part was near 10%.

Sure those are oem (CWT for 750 850 & 1000, smallers r seasonic if I remember correctly) but still it's high percentage.

Your quantity sounds like fanboism just like it is, thats return rate , its measured against sells? More you sell, more BAD ones you have to have to get corsairs 10%.

It's percentages , do you really know what it (%) stands for? Your feeding trolls with that most sold stuff , I do agree tho that theres many corsair psus out there.

What about the beer ? Still its more to do with quality than quantity. Maybe they got quality control covered then, but it obviously has some flaws.

You can decipher that out of those return statistics, check the HX part was near 10%.

Where did you get this information from? Got a link? I've googled it and can't find anything that states a 10% return rate on ay of Corsair's PSU's

Your quantity sounds like fanboism just like it is, thats return rate , its measured against sells? More you sell, more BAD ones you have to have to get corsairs 10%.

Nope, sorry, cold hard facts! And How exactly am I feeding trolls providing nothing but facts. Actually my number was low according to this article which suggests Corsair sells 150,000 PSU's monthly. Which is more than I originally stated.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4011/corsair-ax750-80plus-gold

And I'm sorry, but i went back through and reread my post and I don't see anything wrong with it, or what would be considered "feeding trolls" I'm not sure why you would even take it that way?....

Thanks for joining this thread hms,

@peanutz94

I followed your advice and contacted corsair support again, and they are currently investigating possible options. I haven't given up hope yet on corsair :o:

The quantities of units that corsair has to deal with can be considerable, it just doesn't justify the mistakes. Still new threads are popping up with an hx serie unit that has the fan revving problem, the hx650, 750, 850 and 1050 models can all be found. These are not the newest revisions corsair ships, these are 'relatively' old models that should have matured by now.

If a customer sends in a product with detailed explanation about the problem, surely someone should find it while checking the contents of the box, go to their pears and discuss? And if the actual number of returns are so large that they can't handle it, isn't there a quality problem? or a rma processing problem?

If Corsair decided that the fan behavior is correct, imagine if cars drove the same way:

traffic light turns green, go full speed, linearly decrease speed until stopped and wait until average speed is equal to the allowed speed on that road.

This might sound like a completely off comparison, but its not. It all has to do with controlling and maintaining or reaching an optimum value. The signal is pwm (like most fan controllers) but the controller logic (if there is any) could be flawed.

I'm currently still waiting for Corsair to come with a solution, but if this is truly how the product should work... jeez, it should definitely NOT have the professional label and pricing. (btw, construction quality isn't good either, with sloppy soldering jobs, hazardously exposed mains wires, to220 devices standing freely upright in cramped places...).

We all appreciate your comments and support on this forum peanutz94. Yet I do believe I have a strong case with this one and hopefully find a way to get this fixed, not just for me, but for everyone with an hx serie PSU, and maybe make corsair improve the RMA processing (not sure how to do that yet).

The quantities of units that corsair has to deal with can be considerable, it just doesn't justify the mistakes. Still new threads are popping up with an hx serie unit that has the fan revving problem, the hx650, 750, 850 and 1050 models can all be found.

This is a suport forum. Your going to see threads pop up every day. And your talking just a few here and there and that doesn't count those that don't post here first. But again your talking a few PSU's daily out of how many thousands of unit? Even if you took all of them together that percentage is quite low . And thats not counting legacy products that are getting RMA'd either. So yeah, the amounts they get in returns can huge.

If a customer sends in a product with detailed explanation about the problem, surely someone should find it while checking the contents of the box, go to their pears and discuss? And if the actual number of returns are so large that they can't handle it, isn't there a quality problem? or a rma processing problem?

Again, your dealing with large amounts of units from around the world. And thats just PSU's. Corsair does on occasion have units sent to their own lab for detailed testing, but most just go right back to the factory. If i remember correctly it is only after the factory goes through them that Corsair receives a report on what,how many, and how they failed.

I didn't get a response from corsair yet and I'm still not convinced its sheer 'luck' of getting a hx psu with the revving fan. Yes people with problems tend to scream louder than people who don't... But the number of people who report this particular problem with this series of psu is 'too damn high'. Plus like I said before, not everyone knows this community, or has the ability to report a problem. It is a specific, reoccurring problem with this series of units. It’s not just a single batch, it’s not just a single configuration. Some might think it’s another fan somewhere in their machine or the system load is greater than 400w so the fan keeps running continuously .

Lets try and 'debug' this unit:

I've tried digging around the internet and found the following picture from a review on techpowerup:

http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/Corsair/HX1050/4.html.

If anyone might just have the schematics and share them, that would be splendid (hint :naughty:).

These two pictures show the pcb where the fan is connected to (it is labeled: 'hx 1050 fan card'):

http://tpucdn.com/reviews/Corsair/HX1050/images/in_protections_IC_small.jpg

http://tpucdn.com/reviews/Corsair/HX1050/images/in_protections_IC_daugterboard_small.jpg

According to techpowerup, the DIP device on the first picture is the SiTI PS229 protection controller. It serves for overvoltage, overpower, short circuit protection etc. The datasheet does not mention any fan controlling or pwm functionality: http://www.siti.com.tw/product/spec/Power/SP-PS229-A.004.pdf

The smaller 8 pin surface mount package on the second picture might be the pwm signal generator? (can anyone confirm or give datasheet?) It connects to the to220 device which in turn is connected to the fan connector. This might be a power transistor or mosfet. The circuitry seems similar to the mic502 fan controller, but the pinout of this device is different. :dunno:

Making our own proper fan controller might just be doable in this case, without upsetting the protection circuitry (because there doesn't seem to be any feedback of fan speed, or just pulling high/low a signal line). However it should not be needed with a product in this price range.

Anyone with a hx1050 unit willing to take it apart, for science sake? :p:

@peanutz94

Do you have figures about the sales numbers and rma numbers?. I can't find them anywhere (atleast not reliable ones). I agree that if they sell large quantaties it will affect the RMA process, but I would like to know the numbers. You seem aware of the numbers, can you share a link? :):

@peanutz94

Do you have figures about the sales numbers and rma numbers?. I can't find them anywhere (at least not reliable ones)

Wait! You said they were 10% earlier in this thread.

Maybe they got quality control covered then, but it obviously has some flaws.

You can decipher that out of those return statistics, check the HX part was near 10%.

I asked you for a link which you could not provide.

I also posted the sales figures from anandtech and those were confirmed a while ago. As far as a return rate is concerned RamGuy has stated that the return or RMA's percentage is way less than 5%

Here's a post from RAM GUY ,although it is an AX series PSU, he states failure rates are quite lower than that. And this can also be said for the other lines as well and that information is here in these forums. Even Corsair will tell you it's far less than the industry wide standard of 5% acceptable return rates..

http://forum.corsair.com/v3/showthread.php?t=112836&highlight=PSU+failure+rate

They have in the past acknowledged issues and will do so if those return rates exceed a certain amount. They did it with the GS series last year (hence the 2013 editions)and the Hseries coolers with the pump issues.

If anyone might just have the schematics and share them, that would be splendid (hint

You won't find them anywhere. Even though Corsairs PSu are bulit by x manufacturer, they are built to their own standards. they won't or have not released any schematics for any of their PSU's

I didn't state the 10% rma rate, or any number at all. That was the user hms, not me (drkoster;):). I just want to get the facts straight before making claims.

The post from RAM guy only implies a single model psu. I'm wondering about the hx series. I can't find the claim about the return rates of other series. The sales figures from anandtech cover ALL the psu's, not series in particular. I can't find anything that proves this figure to be true...

So we still don't have any numbers about return rates peanutz94. Maybe they only receive a few from the hx series, maybe they receive a lot of them, we don't know that yet...

Let's do an estimate of the number of returns in general:

150000 sold (according to anandtech) per month,

for ease of calculating, we take the 1% return rate as average (should be even less according to ram guy?). This would mean 1500 a month coming in. If we take an average of 20 working days per month, this would mean 75 come in each working day. If there are 6 people working on the rma floor (sounds reasonable to me) this would mean 12.5 psu to be checked during an 8 hour day per employ. This should be more than enough to actually check the units coming in. If they contain a letter, description or something, there should be enough time for them to read it and maybe do something with it.

Off course, this does not contain the accessories, cases, ram modules and cooling solutions being returned. But I don't expect the people who fix psu's also do all the other categories.

This is mostly guess work because there are no hard facts or numbers. If you can provide those numbers, or see errors in my estimate, please let us know. But as I see it, it might be possible to improve the rma process and fix the hx series design.

I didn't state the 10% rma rate, or any number at all. That was the user hms, not me (drkoster). I just want to get the facts straight before making claims.

Sorry about that. I even went back through the thread to be sure and I still missed it.

If there are 6 people working on the rma floor (sounds reasonable to me) this would mean 12.5 psu to be checked during an 8 hour day per employ. This should be more than enough to actually check the units coming in. If they contain a letter, description or something, there should be enough time for them to read it and maybe do something with it.

But it doesn't work that way. Even if their RMA center worked that way , they are not limited to just PSU's but all of their products coming in to the same hub. This is why the vast majority of the RMA's coming in are not tested in house. There is just too much quantity coming in for them to test everything.

If they contain a letter, description or something, there should be enough time for them to read it and maybe do something with it

They may or may not. They may pull that unit for in house testing, but no one would really know. You wouldn't receive any feedback from it.

Still new threads are popping up with an hx serie unit that has the fan revving problem, the hx650, 750, 850 and 1050 models can all be found.

Yes there are, and I provided the AX series link for comparison. there are far more threads concerning the AX series than the HX on the forums. But at any rate, I'm not going to comment on this any further. I have tried my best to provide you with as much information as possible. If you would like to wait for RamGuy to respond and give you figures , I'm sure he would be willing to do that...or at least some idea of a return rate on these units.

Let's hope corsair will come with a proper solution beginning next week :(: I'll post it when they do.

If ram guy could post some rma and/or sale figures that would be great. But it would be best if there was a (sticky) thread for it in particular, not in this 'hx series cooling design flaw' thread.

This thread has been up for some time now, and no one has come up with a good solution, not even corsair :(: Fingers crossed for now, don't let me down internets!!

WHOOOhooo, GOOD NEWS

I received the following message:

"

Our Technical Support has requested a Failure Analysis for your defective unit. Please use RMA# 1292118 for your request. We have also requested a prepaid label for the return of the defective unit from your location. Please allow 1-2 business days before receiving the label through email.

Once we receive your defective unit, we will send you the replacement after it has been fully tested by our Technical Support team. "

Testing by the technical support team (as what I understand) means they are going to take a closer look. I'm really happy about this fact and hopefully the issue will be resolved :biggrin: Finally some action.

When I have further info, I will post it in this thread.

Well drkoster it seems I have the same problem as yours, see Here

Let us know how you make out - we've (and Corsair) have to get this problem fixed! ...it's such a p.i.t.a to have to take the time and effort to deal with fixing this, especially having already spending so much money in the first place to rise above any cheap problems, but only to get one!

Sorry to hear that you have the same issue Rick. :(: You're not the only one.

My hx1050 was picked up for the second RMA June 7th by UPS. I live in the Netherlands so it should arrive on Monday ~ Tuesday at Corsair. I don't know exactly when or how the Technical Support will handle this. I have a embedded software engineering background, so hopefully I can tackle any questions they can throw at me. I have spend over a month to get this fixed. I'm not gonna give up, not now not ever. :sunglasse

I already did some basic 'debugging' of the unit and made a scetch for my own pwm controller to fit inside the case. If Corsair fails to fix the problem, maybe that can be a solution for you, although, it should not be necesarry in the first place.

Let's keep our hopes up for now and give Corsair the chance and time to fix it. :o: Maybe Ram Guy has some internal info about possible design/board revisions? ;): it shouldn't be a difficult fix for Corsair. But I don't know how long a possible board revision can take.

Thanks for the reply drkoster,

Hello to the Netherlands!!! ...I live in the USA

Yes please do keep me posted of your endeavor and whatever you find out.

I do see the more I search the more and more people that have this problem, and the coil whining too, thankfully I don't have the whine or that would be the last straw to move on.

I love this HX750 if it wasn't for this ramp-up stuff.

Yes I see you have put a lot of time into this.

I liked your idea on the controller. I like the way you think.

I've an electronic background too, but I don't want to open this up to break the seal of course unless I had an exact fix, if I did, I think I would since I am quite capable to make any changes. If Corsair supported it I would even be their beta tester to try things to solve this problem.

Corsair just needs this fan to spin slowly is all, proportionally, and forget about this ramp-up test stuff.

Maybe even a bigger heatsink where needed, at least re-locate the thermistor to a better location. Also maybe a switch on the back to put the auto fan circuit on bypass to let it be 'always on' starting from very low.

Yes please keep me posted, and even PM if you want I'd be pleased with any infos.

Thank you

If Corsair decided that the fan behavior is correct, imagine if cars drove the same way:

traffic light turns green, go full speed, linearly decrease speed until stopped and wait until average speed is equal to the allowed speed on that road.

 

This might sound like a completely off comparison, but its not.

yes this is comparing apples to oranges

every item you mentioned have their own unique problems.

nothing in existence is infallible.

yes this is comparing apples to oranges

I do think it is a valid comparisson. I made it so that people who don't have the problem can get a visual comparisson about how silly it is.

Maybe this is a better comparisson:

It's the same with heating a home. A 'smart' heating solution learns how long it takes to reach a certain temperature. Before the room temperature reaches the desired level, the heating will already be turned off because of the heat capacity in the radiators. Dump solution can easily overshoot the desired level by a large amount.

The hx series runs the fan from 0 to full speed even though that speed is not required. That is because it isn't designed to take into account the actual required airflow whn starting. A 'dump' cooling solution.

It all has to do with reaching and maintaining an optimum value, in this case it is a balance between temperature and noise production. There are many theories, functions and controllers in software and hardware that could have been used to correctly control the fan.

Some material to read about PID controllers on wikipedia for those who are intersted in such controls and processes:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PID_controller

every item you mentioned have their own unique problems.

nothing in existence is infallible.

Did I include links to the wrong threads? Let me know and I'll fix it.

the point i was trying to show is supposedly simple yet obviously over looked is that any product sold is not perfect,there are a percentage that will have problems.

how many of these units are in question here?

5,10,50.100?

probably not but even so a very acceptable margin of failure.

unfortunately some cant accept this because its understandably an inconvenience,so they go on a personal crusade to reek havoc on such an inferior product[in their minds]

many companies would jerk you around and/or censor your disgruntle behavior but outstanding organizations like Corsair tolerate and make every effort to satisfy their customers ,even those that purposely make it a personal vendetta

nuff said

i didnt suggest and dont think this is troll activity

i do however think some here are going way beyond showing their discontent.

i know this if i buy a new item,i want it sealed when i receive it,i sure wouldnt want to hear of it being 'tested' first.and i think thats the only way to insure its a new item and not a used or refurb or return.

its tested when produced and simply redundant to assume corsair should again test it.

I fully agree with you about certain people going way beyond what can be considered reasonable.

When I buy something in the store I want it sealed as well. However, if a product is malfunctioning or incomplete, I want to be sure the replacement unit doesn't have the same problems or misses the same components. If the company can prevent that by simply checking or testing the replacement unit, I think that is good customer service.

I trust Corsair that they wouldn't swap or sell a refurbished unit as new. Corsair isn't a rogue company. I also asked for testing in the ticket that was opened. My hope is that corsair can see / hear the problem for themselves. I don't know how testing happens in the factory, but it's highly unlikely every psu is tested for 20+ minutes at +- 300 watts of load (for the hx1050). It takes way to long to test every psu like this. Factory testing can never cover all situations. That's why product sampling and customer feedback are necessary. If a customer gives feedback, and that feedback is ignored, that's the moment things go wrong.