P6TSE - Upgrading 6GB of TR3X6G1600C7 to 12GB, what DDR3 to use.

Hi,

I have a few memory upgrade questions. My system is as follows:

mobo: ASUS P6T SE

cpu: Core i7 920 D0

RAM: Corsair XMS3 TR3X6G1600C7 6GB DDR3-1600 7-7-7-20 1T timing

I only clock my DDR3 Ram to 1333MHz, 777-20-1T timing.

I want to increase my DDR3 memory to 12 GB (triple channel), but I don't think that I can find the exact same memory anymore.

Q1) Does Corsair still make the TR3X6G1600C7 memory anymore (777-20-1T timing)?

Q2) Now looking at http://www.NCIX.COM, I find these memories in stock and I was wondering if any of these would be recommended for my system (preferably while using my current memory). It does looks like none of them have the correct timing though.

Corsair XMS3 TR3X6G1600C9 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Core i7 Memory Kit $54.98

Corsair XMS3 HX3X12G1600C9 12GB DDR3 6X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Core i7 Memory Kit $94.98

*Corsair XMS3 CMX6GX3M3C1600C7 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 7-8-7-20 1T Core i7 Memory Kit $93.57

Corsair XMS3 CMP6GX3M3A1600C7 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 7-8-7-20 Triple Channel Memory Kit $122.98

Corsair XMS3 CMP12GX3M3A1600C9 12GB DDR3 3X4GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Core i7 Memory Kit $106.98

Q3) I think I can guess one response, but 'Why would I pay more for CMP12GX3M3A1600C9 (and worse timing) when CMX6GX3M3C1600C7 is cheaper and has better timings?'.

Btw, I used http://www.corsair.com/learn_n_explore and it lists the Vengeance line as a possibility for my system - either (CMZ12GX3M3A1600C9) or (CMZ6GX3M3A1600C9)... oh goodie, more options :sigh!:. But they all have the worse 9-9-9-24-2T timing.

Q4) Finally, could someone explain to me the difference between my TR3x6G1600Cx and the current Vengeance line of Corsair memories?

Thanks,

Rob.

Q1) Does Corsair still make the TR3X6G1600C7 memory anymore (777-20-1T timing)?

No , sorry that kit has been discontinued.

Q3) I think I can guess one response, but 'Why would I pay more for CMP12GX3M3A1600C9 (and worse timing) when CMX6GX3M3C1600C7 is cheaper and has better timings?'.

They may be cheaper but Corsair does not recommend or suggest mixing sets. It would be best to just replace all your memory with a matched 12 gig set to avoid compatibility issues between the two sets. Even if you had two set of the exact same part number they still can't guarantee that they would run without issues. For complete compatibility and guaranteed rated speeds all your memory must come from one single matched kit. Adding a second "cheaper" 6 gig kit could very well cost you more in the long run with returns or RMA's if they don't work with each other.

Q4) Finally, could someone explain to me the difference between my TR3x6G1600Cx and the current Vengeance line of Corsair memories?

They are made from a completely different kind of memory chip and another good reason to just get a new matched 12 gig kit. :) Even though they have slightly higher timings it's nothing your going to notice in real world usage without running a memory benchmark to compare the numbers .

No , sorry that kit has been discontinued.

Dang. So any idea why CORSAIR is not making CAS 7 or 8 DDR3 memory anymore, as I only see CAS9 or higher now?

Plus I read online that going from DDR3-1333-9-9-9-24 to 1333-7-7-7-20 gives a similar performance benefit as going from DDR3-1333-9-9-9-24 to DDR3-1600-9-9-9-24.

They may be cheaper but Corsair does not recommend or suggest mixing sets. It would be best to just replace all your memory with a matched 12 gig set to avoid compatibility issues between the two sets. Even if you had two set of the exact same part number they still can't guarantee that they would run without issues.

Well it seems like such a waste to toss the old 6GB, but I understand. Though would under-clocking the memories allow me to have both a new matched 12G set, and my old 6G set, installed at the same time?

I am currently under-clocking my current memory, as I haven't pushed my DDR3 speed past DDR3-1333 MHz (didn't want to increase the voltages).

And,

any suggestions on what I might use then for a 12G set? The ASUS QVL list for the P6T SE is out of date, as they only list the TR3X series and a CM3X series. The CORSAIR site (http://www.corsair.com/learn_n_explore ; Asus P6TSE, 12GB and 24GB, any speed) shows only the CMZ and CMX series but not the CMP series like the one you use (has the CMP series been replaced by the CMZ (Vengeance®) series? Wonder if one is better?).

But these are the memories that the CORSAIR site suggest for my P6TSE:

Vengeance® — 24GB Triple Channel DDR3 Memory Kit (CMZ24GX3M6A1600C9) 1600 Mhz 9-9-9-24-2T 1.5v $259.99 (can't get locally)

Vengeance® — 12GB Triple Channel DDR3 Memory Kit (CMZ12GX3M3A2000C10) 2000 Mhz 10-10-10-27-2T 1.5v $144.99 (locally avail)

Vengeance® — 12GB Triple Channel DDR3 Memory Kit (CMZ12GX3M3A1600C9) 1600 Mhz 9-9-9-24-2T 1.5v $129.99 (locally avail)

XMS3 — 12GB Triple Channel DDR3 Memory Kit (CMX12GX3M3A2000C9) 2000 Mhz 9-9-9-24-2T 1.65v $139.99 (locally avail)

--------

(Note, locally I can get:

CMP24G XMS3 Dominator CMP24GX3M6A1600C9 24GB 6X4GB DDR3-1600 CL9-9-9-24 Triple Channel Memory Kit (CMP24GX3M6A1600C9) $232.35

CMP12G XMS3 Dominator CMP12GX3M3A1600C9 12GB 3X4GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Core i7 Memory Kit (CMP12GX3M3A1600C9) $118.29 )

I am thinking that the CMZ12GX3M3A1600C9 or the equivalent CMP series would work for my needs, but I was wondering what is the difference between the CMP v.s. CMZ series and why the CMP series was not listed by CORSAIR.

Thanks.

EDIT: I missed the CMX series, and the specs for CMX12GX3M3A1600C9 look identical to my TR3X6G1600C7, except that my TR3X has the better 7-7-7-20 timing. So is the 'XMS CMX' series just the 'XMS TR3X' series, but with a different heat spreader? Perhaps I'd have better luck mixing the CMX with my TR3X, while under-clocking, instead of using a Vengeance module?

i.e.

TR3X6G1600C7: http://www.corsair.com/us/tr3x6g1600c7.html

CMX12GX3M3A1600C9: http://www.corsair.com/en/memory-by-product-family/xms-classic/xms3-12gb-triple-channel-ddr3-memory-kit-cmx12gx3m3a1600c9.html

Hi Hardy,

Plus I read online that going from DDR3-1333-9-9-9-24 to 1333-7-7-7-20 gives a similar performance benefit as going from DDR3-1333-9-9-9-24 to DDR3-1600-9-9-9-24.

Possible, but 1600mhz to 1333mhz is really a small memory overclock and again you wouldn't really notice it real world performance without running a benchmark. You may notice the OS a little snappier and so on, but it's not going to be a real major impact on your system. I have the 920 as well and I had to OC the CPU before REALLY noticing any difference. Personally I couldn't be happier with my 92). Pretty good CPU for it's day.

Well it seems like such a waste to toss the old 6GB, but I understand. Though would under-clocking the memories allow me to have both a new matched 12G set, and my old 6G set, installed at the same time?

I am currently under-clocking my current memory, as I haven't pushed my DDR3 speed past DDR3-1333 MHz (didn't want to increase the voltages).

You can try , but there are still no guarantees. Since the 920 has a 1066mhz memory controller.So 1333 is also an overclock but even if you went with 1066 with the mixed kits there just isn't way of knowing if any two random kits are going to work or not. And since you would have two sets made with totally different chips that decreases your chances even further.

I am thinking that the CMZ12GX3M3A1600C9 or the equivalent CMP series would work for my needs, but I was wondering what is the difference between the CMP v.s. CMZ series and why the CMP series was not listed by CORSAIR.

CMP is the Dominator series and CMZ is the Vengeance series. Both great sets but no real performance gain between the two other than the Dominator may provide more overclocking headroom , say , like if you wanted to push the 1600mhz kit past 1600mhz.

I have the 24gig Dominator kit in my machine(see system specs) and love them. They ave been rock stable. But I have never even come anywhere close to using all 24 gigs. Unless your into encoding or rendering, 12 gig's would be plenty.

So basically, it's up to your personal preference and how deep your pockets are! :P

So is the 'XMS CMX' series just the 'XMS TR3X' series, but with a different heat spreader? Perhaps I'd have better luck mixing the CMX with my TR3X, while under-clocking, instead of using a Vengeance module?

TBH I believe they are the same basic chips, but there isn't any way to tell with out a version number. But again, and I hate to keep stressing this , there is just no way to say for sure with any two random kits.

RAM GUY,

IE the B Core 9XXX CPU's cannot run the memory controller voltage over 1.25 Volts so when using a newer part with an older C or D core CPU you may have to manually set the MCH a little higher to make the system stable.

For example if you have a "C" Stepping I9XX the QPI Voltage should not be higher than 1.65 Volts and with a "D" Stepping I9XX CPU the max would be about 1.45 Volts and with the "B" Stepping no higher than 1.25 Volts But with the older "C" stepping they will usually need at least 1.45 Volts to get them above DDR1600.

So I have a i7 920 D0 cpu. Are you saying this core can only take 1.45V on QPI/DRAM voltage. I didn't realize another version of i7 cpus (with 6 cores) where available (I thought they'd be called i9 cpus)?

Also,

given that I have an older i7 920 D0 CPU, can a new [vengenance] module of DDR1600-9-9-9-24 or DDR2000-10-10-10-27 be underclocked but overtimed at DDR1333-8-8-8-20, for example? And is there a formula that would allow us to determine the reduced CAS timings (like maybe: 9*(1/1600)*1333 = new timing value = 7.5)?

Thanks!

P.S. peanutz94, thanks for your feedback too!

So I have a i7 920 D0 cpu. Are you saying this core can only take 1.45V on QPI/DRAM voltage.

That is the max value you should use is what he is saying. But with the C0 steppig CPU you should need no more than 1.45v. If you do it's not going to be worth the risk of damaging the CPU. But this is the risk you take anyway when you decide to start overclocking. I love MNPCtech's slogan. "Voiding your warranty is our business" (they are a performance system builder modding shop)There are alot of other determining factors though...such as CPU cooling,frequency,and so on. Depending on how much memory you have installed and how many slots occupied you might find that you may need slightly higher settings. But it's not recommended that you exceed those because all it does is lead to higher CPU temps and could potentially damage the CPU. If you need to exceed those values to gain stability i would recommend no less than water cooling for the CPU to keep your temps in check and really think to yourself if it's worth it or not..

I didn't realize another version of i7 cpus (with 6 cores) where available (I thought they'd be called i9 cpus)

Yuppers The I7-990X They were in the first gen of performance CPU's thus noted by the 3 digit I7 part number. Great CPU for it's time!

Also,

given that I have an older i7 920 D0 CPU, can a new [vengenance] module of DDR1600-9-9-9-24 or DDR2000-10-10-10-27 be underclocked but overtimed at DDR1333-8-8-8-20, for example? And is there a formula that would allow us to determine the reduced CAS timings (like maybe: 9*(1/1600)*1333 = new timing value = 7.5)?

Yeah..Kind of..the table of trial and error!:p: Seriously all you can do is experiment. You might try some of the overclocking forums about. But you should be able to run them at 1333mhz with tighter timings. Just start out with the advertized timings and start lowering them testing with memtest after ever adjustment to make sure they are stable. Once you hit a value that errors, back it off one and retest.

P.S. peanutz94, thanks for your feedback too!

Sure! Anytime!...and Thank You!