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  #16  
Old 04-01-2006, 04:27 PM
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Based on your specifications you list, you get a better OC with 2 x 256mb (3.4ghz) than you do with 2 x 512mb (3.0ghz). If this is any indication, module density is going to affect your OCability. Can you list what settings you are trying to use including all your voltages, RAM, and CPU settings. Also, do you have any active NB cooling? And, can you relist what PSU you are using and the specs on it?

And, have you reset CMOS since you added the new memory? Often when adding/changing memory, a CMOS reset is required and will work wonders.

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  #17  
Old 04-02-2006, 12:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by specmike
Based on your specifications you list, you get a better OC with 2 x 256mb (3.4ghz) than you do with 2 x 512mb (3.0ghz). If this is any indication, module density is going to affect your OCability.
Actually, most of today's 256MB modules have the very same IC density as their 512MB siblings - because most of today's 256MB modules are SS. However, modern memory controllers perform best with four banks of memory total. 2 x 256MB modules would result in only two banks of memory being used, which may result in lower performance. And that's not to mention that modern 2 x 256MB SS modules share the same OC'ing limits as their 2 x 512MB siblings.

On the other hand, the older 2 x 256MB modules in a DS configuration (with 128Mbit density IC's) would not work with any platform that's newer than a Socket 478 Intel P4 system due to minimum requirements and restrictions of any of the newer memory controllers.

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  #18  
Old 04-02-2006, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wired
They weren't pulled a first time, and one person having problems that haven't even been diagnosed yet is no reason to pull a product off the market.

So, are you running the FSB:MEM ratio @ 1:1, or something else?

Try these settings:

Corsair XMS Qualification and Testing Information

CAS Latency (tCL): 3
RAS to CAS Delay (tRCD): 4
Row Precharge (tRP): 4
Active to Precharge Delay (tRAS): 8
Command Rate: 2T

(yes, I know they're the same, just clarifying what timing is what for other readers)

Memory Voltage: 2.75 Volts (warrantied up to, but not over, 2.90 volts, some have found 2.60 is better for the 4000 series)
All other settings to defaults.

Test one stick at a time in each slot using Memtest86+.
Hello, I call it "pulled" when places were selling these modules, then they just disappeared and also could not be found at the Corsair website. If that's not "pulled" or "recalled", then, whatever you want to call it is fine by me.

Yes, they are 1:1. This mobo doesn't have the Command Rate setting. I find it hard to believe that 2.85v Vs 2.75v can cause all these problems. I didn't try the Vdimm that low, but if you actually think that's the problem, I will. These modules are not at the URL you provided.

Running MemTest, WMD, Prime, etc., and with both or one stick, is irrelevant and a further waste of time. Regardless of 0 errors or a million+ errors, the result is the same; (so far) they don't work and have to be returned/replaced as a matched dual-channel set.
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  #19  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by specmike
Based on your specifications you list, you get a better OC with 2 x 256mb (3.4ghz) than you do with 2 x 512mb (3.0ghz). If this is any indication, module density is going to affect your OCability. Can you list what settings you are trying to use including all your voltages, RAM, and CPU settings. Also, do you have any active NB cooling? And, can you relist what PSU you are using and the specs on it?

And, have you reset CMOS since you added the new memory? Often when adding/changing memory, a CMOS reset is required and will work wonders.

Mike.
Hi, I've already listed the memory settings, what other settings do you want me to list? I'm not interested so much in an O'clock, the memory is...was not O'clocked so this should have no bearing on anything. My CPU is capable of at least 3.6ghz (tested with some other test memory). I think I listed in my specs that I WAS using a 512mb DC kit (PC4000, another brand) that would do 281mhz bus (~3.4ghz). I then got the same brand and model in a 1gb DC kit (what's currently in the PC) that will only do its rated DDR500. The CPU is more than capable of running the 3.3ghz these Corsair modules support.

Since all S478 HT P4 platforms use the 200mhz bus, ANY memory over PC3200 is an O'clock of the CPU @ 1:1 ratio. So even PC3500 memory using an HT P4 platform is an O'clock. Using PC4400 memory at its default speed is of course an even higher O'clock of the CPU, and since this PC4400 memory was supposed to run in this P4 platform as told to me by Corsair, it should do just that and at its rated specs.

I haven't installed the Sintek 500SLI yet, I'm using the Fortron-Source FSP400-60PFN ( http://www.tomshardware.com/2003/06/...rs/page15.html ), actually is 450 watts. I don't recall the specs on it, but they are somewhere in that review. It's a very highly rated PS by every site that's tested it.

Not only does the NB have a fan, but the highest temps I've EVER got on any piece of hardware is only about 100°F and that's the CPU under load! Everything runs very cool, usually even cooler than room temp. I have everything monitored with a DigiDoc 5.

You already know my memory timings & settings, CPU settings (and Vcore is 1.6v), and all other memory settings are set to [Auto]. There's only about 2 others besides the x-x-x-x memory timings. FYI, mobo manual: http://dlsvr03.asus.com/pub/ASUS/mb/...0-e_deluxe.pdf , around page 86 is memory settings. The only other adjustable voltage is AGP which is set to 1.7v.

I haven't reset the CMOS, I don't see how that would help, but again, if you think it will I'll try it. It's just a PITA to get things set back after that.
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  #20  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:29 PM
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What the hell happened to my other MAIN post on this!??? Someone from Corsair didn't "like the sound" of it?? "TWINX2048-4400PRO Disastrous results!! BSOD's, Desktop barely loads, now HD corrupt!!" http://www.houseofhelp.com/forums/sh...d.php?p=243992 . THAT is the thread where this conversation should be held since this is a NEW issue! Because of the title, this thread title is now obsolete and irrelevant, and will yield far fewer replies and information than the other thread!
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  #21  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clint H.
Hello, I call it "pulled" when places were selling these modules, then they just disappeared and also could not be found at the Corsair website. If that's not "pulled" or "recalled", then, whatever you want to call it is fine by me.
http://www.houseofhelp.com/v2/showthread.php?t=48305

Only just came out in the retail market it looks like.
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  #22  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:39 PM
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From both posts above, the reason the modules "disappeared" is that they were out of stock. These modules and the sister modules (PC3500LL) sell VERY fast and frequently disappear from stock listings.

I would suggest either 2.85v or 2.85v on memory. This can make a huge difference.

And, testing each stick individually is not a waste or time. IF you find that each stick will run individually then, you have determined that the memory is not faulty. Therefore, some other system component is responsible.

Also, I have not Googled for your power supply specifications. However, what you are posting "could" be a power related issue.

As to the settings, there are 2 you should double check AFTER resetting CMOS. Make sure in the CPU section that the Performance Mode is set to STANDARD. And, in the memory section make sure the Memory Performance Mode is set to AUTO. I can't explain to you in scientific terms why resetting CMOS could be helpful here but, RAM GUY frequently recommends it so I am confident that there is a valid reason for it.

As for memory timings, I always prefer to set the 4 primary timings manually. I don't trust the bios to do it for me. I would suggest using the timings provided above by Wired set manually and also set burst length to 8.

And just so we are clear:

Quote:
Since all S478 HT P4 platforms use the 200mhz bus, ANY memory over PC3200 is an O'clock of the CPU @ 1:1 ratio. So even PC3500 memory using an HT P4 platform is an O'clock. Using PC4400 memory at its default speed is of course an even higher O'clock of the CPU, and since this PC4400 memory was supposed to run in this P4 platform as told to me by Corsair, it should do just that and at its rated specs.
What you have posted here is not exactly accurate. If you are at a 1:1 AND with the CPU FSB still at 200mhz, then the CPU and the memory are NOT OCed. Just because memory is rated at PC4400 does mean it is running 4400. You probably realize this but the way you worded it makes me wonder. What is the fastest FSB you have previously run stable?

Quote:
What the hell happened to my other MAIN post on this!??? Someone from Corsair didn't "like the sound" of it??
And, it's a weekend so no one from Corsair is here. Also, you seem upset since your computer is having problems but the mild expletives are against forum rules.

Mike.
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  #23  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wired
http://www.houseofhelp.com/v2/showthread.php?t=48305

Only just came out in the retail market it looks like.
Naa, like I said they were being sold many months back, then left the scene and left Corsair's site. During that time I saw reviews on them and many were indicating there were 3D crashes using them. Because of these items is why I used the term "pulled".
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  #24  
Old 04-02-2006, 11:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clint H.
Naa, like I said they were being sold many months back, then left the scene and left Corsair's site. During that time I saw reviews on them and many were indicating there were 3D crashes using them. Because of these items is why I used the term "pulled".
Not the 2gb versions. The 2gb kits ( 2 x 1024mb ) have just been released. Wired gave you the info above. And it hit shelves after the PC3500LL which is based on the same IC. You might be thinking of the PC4400C2.5 (512mb modules only) or the PC40002gb kit which was totally different memory.

Regradless of the misconception this RAM has not been "pulled". And, it has nothing to do with your current problem.
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  #25  
Old 04-03-2006, 12:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clint H.
What the hell happened to my other MAIN post on this!??? Someone from Corsair didn't "like the sound" of it?? "TWINX2048-4400PRO Disastrous results!! BSOD's, Desktop barely loads, now HD corrupt!!" http://www.houseofhelp.com/forums/sh...d.php?p=243992 . THAT is the thread where this conversation should be held since this is a NEW issue! Because of the title, this thread title is now obsolete and irrelevant, and will yield far fewer replies and information than the other thread!
You were double posting and as such the threads were automatically combined.


Quote:
Originally Posted by specmike
I would suggest either 2.85v or 2.85v on memory. This can make a huge difference.
2.75 - 2.85 I take it? :)
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  #26  
Old 04-03-2006, 12:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by specmike
From both posts above, the reason the modules "disappeared" is that they were out of stock. These modules and the sister modules (PC3500LL) sell VERY fast and frequently disappear from stock listings.

I would suggest either 2.85v or 2.85v on memory. This can make a huge difference.

And, testing each stick individually is not a waste or time. IF you find that each stick will run individually then, you have determined that the memory is not faulty. Therefore, some other system component is responsible.

Also, I have not Googled for your power supply specifications. However, what you are posting "could" be a power related issue.

As to the settings, there are 2 you should double check AFTER resetting CMOS. Make sure in the CPU section that the Performance Mode is set to STANDARD. And, in the memory section make sure the Memory Performance Mode is set to AUTO. I can't explain to you in scientific terms why resetting CMOS could be helpful here but, RAM GUY frequently recommends it so I am confident that there is a valid reason for it.

As for memory timings, I always prefer to set the 4 primary timings manually. I don't trust the bios to do it for me. I would suggest using the timings provided above by Wired set manually and also set burst length to 8.

And just so we are clear:



What you have posted here is not exactly accurate. If you are at a 1:1 AND with the CPU FSB still at 200mhz, then the CPU and the memory are NOT OCed. Just because memory is rated at PC4400 does mean it is running 4400. You probably realize this but the way you worded it makes me wonder. What is the fastest FSB you have previously run stable?



And, it's a weekend so no one from Corsair is here. Also, you seem upset since your computer is having problems but the mild expletives are against forum rules.

Mike.
Mike I mentioned in my first post that I tried 2.85v, as well as setting the memory timings myself to what is spec'd.

This is a DUAL CHANNEL KIT, as the name implies--meaning, two modules working together in a symbiotic relationship as tested by Corsair, and to work in my platform. If they do not work as dual channel, like they are supposed to do, there is something wrong with them, therefore the memory as a paired DC kit IS faulty because then it would not be a matched dual channel kit as it is sold and marketed. I know you're going to try and defend Corsair on this though, so I'm sure it's useless on my part.

As for a PS related issue, I DID think about that, and what I'm going to try is to hook my AIW 9800 Pro up to an external AT PSU and see if that changes anything. As we know, these modules have the LED's on them, and while they draw negligible power, FAIK there could be "other related more power-hungry components" in these modules that support the LEDs' functionality. Only Corsair may know that.

If PAT and PM has to be set to "Auto" (which is off most of the time), and IF that makes these modules work, then they are not worth having, for setting these to Auto/off adversely affects performance and negates $310 PC4400 memory. I KNOW, I've tested the various settings.

I never said the memory and CPU were o'clocked using PC3200 memory, quite the contrary, please read again: ANY memory over PC3200 is an O'clock of the CPU @ 1:1 ratio. Meaning, if you set your BIOS to DDR400 with PC3200 memory and @1:1, and or 200mhz bus, your CPU (and memory) are running at default speeds. Furthermore, running PC3500 as I indicated IS an o'clock IF it is run at its default speed in the above scenario.

Quote:
And, it's a weekend so no one from Corsair is here.
Then that doesn't explain how the thread in question disappeared.
Quote:
Also, you seem upset since your computer is having problems but the mild expletives are against forum rules.
HA! You don't know the half of it. The last 6 months or so around here has been hell. Non-working 310 buck memory is just another addition. Ooops, or should I say "heck", or is it OK to say that?

I'm going to reset the CMOS, hook up the AT PSU, give that a shot and see what happens. Does anyone have any comment on "AGP Aperture Size" and its possible affect on this problem?
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  #27  
Old 04-03-2006, 12:23 AM
Clint H. Clint H. is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wired
You were double posting and as such the threads were automatically combined.
This much I gathered, but my point is it should have been the OTHER thread kept and the this one deleted because it was the other thread with the more appropriate title which gave a more accurate representation of the issue.
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  #28  
Old 04-03-2006, 12:29 AM
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Quote:
This is a DUAL CHANNEL KIT, as the name implies--meaning, two modules working together in a symbiotic relationship as tested by Corsair, and to work in my platform. If they do not work as dual channel, like they are supposed to do, there is something wrong with them, therefore the memory as a paired DC kit IS faulty because then it would not be a matched dual channel kit as it is sold and marketed. I know you're going to try and defend Corsair on this though, so I'm sure it's useless on my part.
You need to reread my post. I understand what memory and MOBO you have. I have (essentially) the same memory and 6 of the MOBOs. I am not defending Corsair, I am trying to explain methodic troubleshooting to you. IF EACH MODULE IS CERTIFIED TO RUN INDIVIDUALLY THEN THE PROBLEM IS NOT THE MEMORY. It could be a MOBO, CPU, PSU, or other limitation that is causing the problems. You need to verify this before you can make any other conclusions with any certainty. I see frequent cases where people discover that their memory is just fine if tested as single sticks. But, they discover system problems when they try to use them as a pair. This means they have problems other than the memory.

If you are not going to atleast try some of the suggestions here the we are all wasting our time.

"PAT" as you have referenced is not the Performance Acceleration Technology in the 875P architecture. This is a common misconception for this MOBO but you don't turn PAT off and on in the bios. These settings I listed for you have nothing to do with PAT. And, if you want a stable OC then you need to set them as I noted.

Memory PM is a stupid setting and should be removed from the bios. It is a marketing tool and is only an artificial method for the bios to manipulate latencies. This often comflicts with manual bios settings and causes instability. Set it to AUTO when you set your timings manually.

There are MODs here from the House of Help which is where Corsair is hosted. They don't work for Corsair. See post by Wired for clarification.
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  #29  
Old 04-03-2006, 01:30 AM
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Quote:
IF EACH MODULE IS CERTIFIED TO RUN INDIVIDUALLY THEN THE PROBLEM IS NOT THE MEMORY.
Once again, this a CERTIFIED DUAL CHANNEL KIT. NOT SINGLE sticks, but TWO sticks certified to run in DUAL CHANNEL mode, hence their nomenclature and would not nor should not be sold under the false pretense of said "DUAL channel kit" if they are not just that. I did not purchase two single TwinX1024-PC4400 Pro sticks for $310 per say. I purchased a dual channel kit, named TwinX2048-4400 Pro. There is a big difference. So are you trying to tell me that a DUAL CHANNEL memory kit isn't really supposed to work in DC mode...even after being told they WILL? I think not. I couldn't care less if one stick works fine, I DO NOT WANT TO USE one stick, but BOTH, TWO of them as the complete kit under which they were purchased. If one works fine, you can't send only one stick back hoping you might get another one in replacement that might match the one you keep so they'll work together in DC mode. I have much experience with many DC kits in many customers' PC's that did not work, sent them back, and got in return MATCHED sticks that DID work as they should have in the first place. If these were any CPU or mobo, or "system problem", the replacements would not have worked.

I've been running DC kits in this mobo since day one, 3+ years ago. It is NOT my mobo, CPU, and now I've determined it's not the PSU*. If I had "system problems" then I would not be able to run my other DC memory kits. If you're saying that I STILL COULD, then please explain that. Sorry but you really sound like a CSR that blames other things than the product in question.

I don't recall saying I was unwilling to try suggestions, where do you see that? In fact, I even SAID I would try them! And, I just did, and I'm just now back from that: I put the sticks back in, reset the CMOS, changed Vdimm to 2.75v, *moved the AIW 9800 Pro power cable to the AT PSU (thinking it may be possible the memory is drawing too much from the PS), and still the same problem: BSOD and the "IRQL_NOT_LESS_OR_EQUAL". Now so far, this points to a bad/unmatched, (whatever you choose to call it) DC memory kit.

I've been on the P4C800xx thread at another forum for so long, and they all started calling it PAT for some reason and so did I, but we know what it really is. It's actually PAM in this mobo--Performance Acceleration Mode is to what I was referring.

Performance Mode does indeed make a difference...at least it does on THIS mobo. Like I said, I have tested its various settings on AIDA32, Sandra, PCmark04/05, Winbench, 3DMark, SpecView, et al, and there IS a marked difference.
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  #30  
Old 04-03-2006, 01:40 AM
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Two other things I should mention in the event someone should ask...."Legacy USB" is off in the BIOS, as is "Spread Spectrum", both common problem areas.

Tomorrow, as a last resort, I may hook up another HD, format and see what that does. IF anyone thinks that would matter.
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